Episode 21 - My Husband’s Feet
In this episode of Awesome Etiquette
How do you tell a loved one that they need to spruce up their personal hygiene without hurting their feelings?
Speaker 1: Maybe it's just that you don't know how to use social courtesy. That's old fashioned.
Speaker 1: Watch. How is he
Speaker 2: Post and damn Post Center actors, host and hostess?
Speaker 2: They know that courtesy means showing respect, thinking of the other person.
Speaker 1: Really friendliness. Hello and welcome to another episode of awesome etiquette. We're so proud to be part of the infinite guest network from American Public Media. I'm Lizzie Post,
Speaker 2: and I'm Dan Post sending from the Emily Post Institute.
Speaker 1: Dan, I don't know about you, but one of the one of the biggest questions I get like, topics that people seem thio want to talkto us about or at least me about don't know about you but is wow, you work with your family. Isn't that fun? Really? That is not what they say to me. I always get the I could never do that. How do you do that? You're
Speaker 2: like, Well, let's show
Speaker 1: up every day and I get a paycheck.
Speaker 1: It helps. It helps. It really doesn't know its work. And you gotta You gotta be professional. It is, but it's even so.
Speaker 1: It's funny, you know, People talk about nepotism. They talk about all the downsides of working with the family business and trust me there there. It's taken our family a lot from when we first started and really worrying about not favoring post family members within the business were tiny there. Right now, there are only two people who work at organization who are not family, and one of them has been close friends with my parents for, gosh, 10 15 years. So she's practically family, and the other has just joined us this past year. So he's really getting used to us, and
Speaker 2: it's been kind of fun. Toe, well, fun. It's been It's been a process toe. Meet the family again through the eyes of someone new who is really getting to know the organization well.
Speaker 1: But the truth of the matter is, it's not easy at all. Everyone says, Oh, I could never for a reason. It is really hard to work with your family.
Speaker 1: It's so incredibly complicated because you love someone very deeply, but you might get really, really frustrated with them. Um, either their style of work, a particular decision on a particular part of the business, and then at the same time, you have to go toe Christmas dinner with, um,
Speaker 2: go home that night. Who's gonna take care of Mom and Dad's cat today?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's, you know, there there really are a lot of ins and outs of it. And one thing I've always been really grateful for is that our family gatherings I feel like I have never once been affected by any problem at the office that our our family moments are really no matter how much like I have never accepted an invitation to go up to dance cabin on the mountain. I feel terrible because Buja is always like, Come on, all of a
Speaker 2: sudden we're entertaining.
Speaker 1: I know, and it's it's different, and I Dan and I love each other very much. We actually have a lot of fun together. We've driven across the country together. I mean, we've had some kind of really memorable emotionally, no question. Yeah, for sure. But we have no desire after spending all week together to go hang out for the Solstice party or the bonfire because the sauna just got finished. Like it's
Speaker 2: funny. No desire. I issue the invitations and I issue them the same way you do. Some things just sort of performer. You do them thio eso I make invitations so busy we're having a solstice bonfire and having a bunch of people up. You know, you really haven't been up for dinner yet. Would you like thanks so much for inviting me?
Speaker 1: No, that's how you do it. But it's true. It's because we see each other all the time. And for the most part, we spend our little breaks that we're catching up on our life's problems are Life's issues are life's joys, and it's like I think we would get up there and maybe not even know it.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. It's quite possible, quite possible, Um, and I'll reflect back at you something that when I first started working at Emily Post, my mother was working there full time also, and we used to set a rule for ourselves because we carpool sometimes in and out of ducks Berry, which is a good half hour, 40 minutes exactly at at the minimum, we'd meet at the Richmond Park and ride. We have 20 minutes together, and the rule was that by the time we get the Richmond Park and ride, we no longer talked work that we had to leave the work behind at some point so that we could continue to have a relationship, his mother and son. But it took that kind of discipline. By the time we're about 15 minutes down the road from MP, I would say, You know, we had to stop talking about FBI. Let's talk anything else.
Speaker 1: You do have to find the things that connect you as a family and really promote them and be active about engaging in them, because otherwise it does all become business. I remember my mom and dad. I owned an advertising agency, and my mom's sister worked for them. And when they would get together with, um, my mom's sister and her husband, my Uncle Jay
Speaker 1: Every now and again, they just would all of a sudden realized or J would have to remind them, you know, afterwards, he talked to Sarah about it. How hey, we I I don't know what's going on at the office, So talking about work when we're having dinner isn't fun for me.
Speaker 2: I'm sympathizing for John, sending all of
Speaker 1: us right, or Matt Bush Lo and his husband like it's It is one of those things where and he actually worked with us, so that's a little different, because he kind of has that insider knowledge. But it is one of those things where it is so much a part of our lives that I love the fact that when we when we do have Christmas, when we do get together as a family family, people will ask how things are going at the institute. But for the most part, this is family time, and we talk about about family and personal lives. And I really like that. No matter how difficult things have gotten at the office and trust me, they get difficult. Just because we're etiquette experts doesn't mean we get it right all the time. Um, it's so wonderful to know that on the other side of it is a really strong family that you'll have no matter
Speaker 2: what you can count on.
Speaker 1: That being said, I think I need a sabbatical. Do you need a sabbatical?
Speaker 2: I think sabbaticals. Air rate.
Speaker 1: I think we all need a break consuming
Speaker 2: work and I think particularly the the members of the family there in our generation hope to plan to do this work for a long time and to really make that work sustainable. The idea of thinking about ways to continue to refresh and rejuvenate and restore yourself it's really important. I mean, it's important for academics. I think that's a great model. Um, and I think it's definitely something we should be keeping keeping open to the possibility of questions.
Speaker 1: So if you've ever wondered how we get things done at the Emily Post Institute, when we come up with ideas, we put them into the podcast, where we know that my father, our director Peter Post, will be listening. Dad, did you pick up the hint E well, and
Speaker 2: you're getting close to something else. You also have the unique situation with several members of your nuclear family,
Speaker 1: not several all. I only have one sister. All four of us work together. I mean, my mom edits my column that women's running like, you know, my dad is e. I mean, he's so special to me. He's my go to person, and I have to be careful with that because you don't want to just over overstep your bounds with that, and we'll wanting
Speaker 2: to acknowledge the challenge of it. I'll tell you from the perspective of ah, closely removed outside of
Speaker 1: because you just you It's
Speaker 2: also a very close family. And I think that a lot of strength from our business comes from it also. I mean, those bonds are incredibly close, and you all know each other so well. You complete each other's thoughts, and the first it's a little intimidating. But it's also, um, there's no question that's an advantage.
Speaker 1: What's it like, though not being that? Because I only know it as being, like not only in the family, but then in this immediate family, where all of us work together because you have family members. Will doesn't work with us. What's
Speaker 2: that? At first it was a little unnerving, a little unsettling, and it took me a while to figure it out. Took years to sort of watch the dynamics at play and to get more comfortable with that, Um, I also really appreciate, um, the way everybody I think in your family, in their own way have made a real effort to acknowledge that slight difference in my relationship to the family business and and have been really accommodating. I know your father just a for example, for everybody out there. When he sends emails that goto Louisiana and and me, he rotates around the order that he puts those names at the top of the email just so that he doesn't give the appearance of favor, just a small point of etiquette. It's a small courtesy, and yet it's little things like that, um, in the end end up communicating that that he values everybody that we all have a place there that he wants to treat us as equals professionally, even if I'm never going to be his daughter.
Speaker 1: One of the things about the post side of the family that I also find really interesting is that, um, like, for instance, I was talking with Pete, our cousin, who, growing up was like a brother to me. I always looked up to him. Um, hey, really is And and I was talking with him about getting together for lunch and having him come to spin class. I go thio, And what I love is that even though Dan and I know each other's lives pretty much inside and out, I mean, we truly are like brother and sister at this point and What I think is so amazing, though, is that I don't feel any less close to any of our other cousins just because we work together. It's funny it hasn't somehow like our relationship at work hasn't somehow trumped my relationships with the rest of the family just because we do this thing to put
Speaker 2: it Emily posters. There's a whole social architecture to the family that's that's independent of the business and I think helps sustain those relationships. And I guess it's in the moment. Remind me how important some of those things are. Some of those those events that really tie families together
Speaker 1: well, that's a little insight into what it is like to work as a family at the Emily Post Institute.
Speaker 2: And we just something else we're really keenly aware of is just how many people work for family business. The percentage of the U. S economy that is connected to or touched by family businesses is absolutely staggering and
Speaker 1: so many different ways that families make it work and make decisions around it. It's it's fascinating
Speaker 2: to me, absolutely, and you'll hear lots about it. If you keep listening to the pot,
Speaker 1: it's true. Let's get to some of your questions for today. Sure, you're right. There's so much to learn how to do. Sure, there's a lot to learn, but it's worth it. And learning is easy. One way is by watching others on
Speaker 2: each and every episode of awesome etiquette. We take your questions on how to behave our etiquette questions. Inbox is filling up fast these days. So today we're going to do on all questions show without further ado. Let's get started
Speaker 1: this week. We have a number of detailed questions and short questions. I was kind of impressed with the with the variety that we got, Um, but this one right here is a total classic.
Speaker 1: Hi, Lizzie and Daniel. I have a problem. I am married to the most wonderful man. I will just say flat out, This does not sound like a problem, All right? He's carrying kind, thoughtful, and everyone loves him.
Speaker 2: All good.
Speaker 1: All good? Yeah, there's just one issue. His feet smell. Uh, I don't think this would be noticed by friends or anyone else, but I cuddle with him all the time and have never been able to get used to it. And it does bother me. He actually has great cleaning practices. He isn't a dirty guy at all. And yet I just don't know if he's aware of this phenomenon or if there is even a solution to it.
Speaker 1: I even bought him new sneakers, but the smell came back. How do I address such a sensitive subject with someone who's so close to me? I don't want to embarrass him at all. I would feel terrible if I made him super self conscious, but it's been a long time coming. I've been dying to have my question answered for a while now, but I can't ask friends or family because I don't want to draw attention to the smell. Please help signed need to breathe. This is
Speaker 2: the classic etiquette question. If there's someone that I'm very close to, and there's something that they don't know about and it's awkward, potentially don't know about, and it's awkward or embarrassing or I can't help but notice I need to know how to bring it up with them. This is one of those moments where I love to remind everybody out there that we will all have changing personal grooming and hygiene habits over the course of a lifetime, and it's it's not a bad thing to every once in a while, do a little self assessment. Take stock. Ask questions of yourself that you are usually not asking yourself like am I really bathing properly every day? It's not a given. It doesn't mean that you weren't raised well or that, um, you don't have the best of intentions. But you're probably not going to smell your own bad breath. You're probably. And maybe you picked up a coffee habit since the last time you set up your brushing routine. Maybe you need to brush mid morning now, anyway, So it's a little reminder to everyone out there that it can be hard for people to talk about this stuff with us. So So it's up to all of us to be a little bit diligent. Okay, off my soapbox, back to the question, um, so having a difficult conversation? One of the tips I learned from a former employee of a major corporation is you can prime someone by asking permission to have the conversation. There's something a little awkward that I'd really like to talk with you about is now a good time and all of a sudden there mentally prepared for something that's
Speaker 1: maybe it'll be a little awkward, difficult to embarrass. Mentally prepared. I get mentally anxious. I would be like, Oh, my gosh, What is wrong? What do I do? So tone of voice, you're
Speaker 2: gonna let him know it's okay by staying calm by staying present, you're gonna do it. If that's the moment to have the conversation, you can ask permission just to have it. Even in that moment, I don't need to schedule. It doesn't need to be that way. There's something I really need to talk to you about. Could we get together after dinner? E. You know, something a little difficult? I've been meaning to To talk about with you. Now, be a good time. Yeah, sure, No problem. And then they're in and you've got their permission, thereby in, um, I like it. Think about how you would wanna be approached. Um, tell them that if the roles were reversed, you'd hope that they would talk to you about something like this, or that they would be comfortable talking to you about something like this. That if the shoe was on the other foot that you would want to know about it, and you would hope they would tell you This is also good sample language, toe intro and to the topic. The other thing I might, um, prepare yourself for ahead of time is to think about exactly the thing that it is that you want to address so that you don't end up calling into question their hygiene habits in general, which clearly don't seem to be a problem for you here, but it really is a specific problem. It's in this case, the way these feet smell.
Speaker 1: So would you suggest maybe starting out with that? Like, you know, I'm even struggling me struggling with the language here. What would you say? You know, I know that you have great hygiene, but
Speaker 2: there's something I noticed. There's something bubbling up on the couch
Speaker 1: and it doesn't seem to go away kind of no matter what foot where you're wearing, and then you drop the bomb, that it's your feet smell.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you can ask them, Say, are you aware of this? Is this something that you're trying to address is it might be something completely unaware of And then the conversation starts off really easily. Um, fresh socks and a shower after you exercise, um, might be suggestions may be
Speaker 1: getting the sense he does. These things, though, doesn't sound like dirty socks or
Speaker 2: so then it's a trickier conversation. This might be a health question, and this is one of the reasons that the doctor or something, perhaps you might want to talk to a doctor. If something's persistent, you can't address it, and it matters to you. And if it's mattering to the people around you, it's probably gonna matter to you. This is where I want to tell a little bit of personal story about a friend of mine who had a problem with smelly feet lasted a long time, and this friend was on a little bit on the alternative edge of the health spectrum. And this person diligently washed their feet with cider vinegar for a long time, taking ah homeopathic home care remedy to try toe to deal with feet that were smelly.
Speaker 1: I had an old roommate that would shower in it, and I finally told him he couldn't because it smelled so bad in
Speaker 2: the cider vinegar cider
Speaker 1: I didn't like showering in a salad dressing
Speaker 2: way, had a very plain conversation. One day he sort of confessed to me that he was having trouble with his feet, and it was It was a problem for me, didn't know what to do about. He was frustrated. I said, You know, have you tried on athletes? Foot cream
Speaker 2: know that it never occurred to him before
Speaker 1: that it might be athletes feet causing the
Speaker 2: anti fungal athletes foot cream that you could buy over the counter top in any gas station or a drug store in the country cleared it up in a matter of weeks.
Speaker 1: That's amazing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Sometimes it's really about just a slightly different perspective. Joining you, looking at the problem. And this could be a simple A some athletes foot cream, something that you wouldn't think I'm You know, I don't I'm not a big athlete today. That's not something that I'd get problem solved.
Speaker 1: That might even be a way for for this person to approach it is to say Hey, hey, honey, I picked up some some athletes foot cream for you. I've just noticed that there is an odor and it seems persistent and I can't figure it out because you're clean. You always put on fresh socks. You do buy new shoes every now and again. But for some reason, this keeps happening. And I just I was hoping that maybe this would help solve it.
Speaker 2: You're getting us around with last tip. I would give on a difficult conversation. If you're gonna raise a problem, be ready to talk about some solutions, have some ideas and and maybe Maybe that's just the suggestion. Maybe you've already got that foot cream in your purse,
Speaker 1: so I'm gonna add one more thing. Thio all of Dan's advice, which is great advice. And that is, um, one thing he's brought up on the show before, and that's the platinum rule. And think about who you're dealing with here. You know, your husband really, really well need to breathe. And I believe that you know whether he would appreciate humor in this situation or gentle sincerity or the solution I gave which was toe to come at it with with something right there in hand to try. Um, I think you know your husband really, really well. So think about him and how he receives this type of information and really try to come. Come at it with that in mind so that you can be as successful as possible with this conversation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and with with a little bit of forethought, like was he says you're gonna be in good shape, but definitely don't be afraid to bring it up for addressing, because definitely impacts affects you when he's gonna wanna know.
Speaker 1: And clearly there's so much other awesome stuff about this guy that this is a small thing, but it's a small thing. You don't wanna have to live. What, so we get it? We hope that helps you out. And good luck.
Speaker 2: Our next question comes from out West. Hello, Lizzie and Dan. A warm welcome from Sunny California to you.
Speaker 1: I can't tell if I'm jealous or really happy that we got a warm welcome from Sunny California because it is six degrees outside today. There's
Speaker 2: something my older sister has been doing that's been bugging me for a while. Hopefully, you, too, will be able to put it to arrest once and for all. My boyfriend and I think it's disrespectful to leave the house while the rest of my family is eating dinner. Once we hear my dad cooking, we use that as a cue to leave the house and go eat, even if we haven't figured out where to go. When we come back, we peek into the house to make sure they're not eating, and then we head in if it's safe. My sister, on the other hand, likes to leave with her boyfriend while the family is eating. Either that or she'll come back as the family is still eating. She does as she pleases. We've been tolerating this behavior for a few years now. I'm sorry, but I can't help but think it's incredibly rude that she comes in and out of the house during such a personal time, like a family meal. It might not help, but the front doors insight from the dining room is this even considered rude behavior and etiquette. It might just be annoying to me. I have discussed this with the rest of the family, and they agree that it's not the most polite behavior, but no one wants to bring it
Speaker 1: up. Thio.
Speaker 2: If she's being rude, is there a way to tell her politely without stepping on any toes. We just want to eat in peace. Help be,
Speaker 1: Oh, be. That's an awkward one. I'm There's a couple things that confused me in this question. Um, one is the leaving while the parents eat and then coming back. And I'm not sure I understand that, because if I was at my parents house now, granted, they live in the country, so there aren't very many places to go hang out while they eat dinner. But I'm if I was at my parents house and they were going to cook dinner on
Speaker 1: either I would just leave for the night and not come back. Or they would invite me to stay for dinner, and I would just join them for the meal. I completely agree with her that the sister getting up in the middle of the meal and leaving with her boyfriend is not appropriate unless there's some reason for it, like they have a movie that they're going to, and that's the movie time. So they're gonna eat quickly and leave the rest of the family to finish. But those were kind of more, more like, you know, specific circumstances in general. Yes, it's rude that she's doing this, but I still don't get the like. We're peaking in to make sure they're not. I mean, you wouldn't do that anyone's house if you showed up. I'm confused and help me out here. I'm reading
Speaker 2: this as concern around a general etiquette concept of that. It's it's a good practice not to disturb someone when they're
Speaker 1: I like that idea.
Speaker 2: Um and
Speaker 2: yeah, the idea of Of of this sort of peeking into the house to see if dinner's finished yet or not, reads a
Speaker 1: little sort of etiquette. Extreme. A same
Speaker 2: time, I think it's I'm I'm also reading the question away. That's painting a picture of that. We really try to take care. We tried toe not just come and go during dinner time or specifically, while people are sitting down. It looks like a dining room table having a family dinner that happens at a dining room table and that the sister doesn't seem thio.
Speaker 2: I definitely am. I'm a little curious about the
Speaker 2: sit down, maybe just sit down and have dinner with the parents, but that doesn't seem to be the routine, um,
Speaker 1: doesn't. So I do. I appreciate
Speaker 2: the General care. But I also would say that, um, my my sister's keeper on some level, is it really up to you to be monitoring this behavior? It sounds like you've checked in with the rest of the family.
Speaker 1: It's affecting.
Speaker 2: Um, people think it's rude, but that maybe it's not necessarily something that they want to make a big to do about if it is affecting you. If it's to the point where it really bothers you, Um, it's a running point of conversation with you and your boyfriend. Generally speaking, it's not a good practice toe. Have things about other people. You talk about a lot that you wouldn't be comfortable talking about with them.
Speaker 1: So if you're bringing up to your family and your boyfriend all the time, you might as well talk to the sister about it.
Speaker 2: I think that's appropriate. Um,
Speaker 1: personally, I'm thinking that the parents need to do the talking because they're the hosts of this house. It's their dinner table. It's not the younger sisters dinner table. It's the parents dinner table, and I think that she should, um ah, word I hate should. But I think that she should, um, let the parents decide whether this is gonna be behavior that they tolerate and that they decide it's not worth it. For them to have the conversation, it doesn't bother them that much. And therefore it's their house. Their rules,
Speaker 2: rather than the daughter feels comfortable coming and going and they want
Speaker 1: to see exactly. So I would I would talk with your parents more about that part of it and then just decide that if that's what they choose to dio, that's their house. That's their rules. And just be prepared that your sister might act this way. We agree with you. We think it's not the most polite behavior, but it isn't your home. And I think correcting your sister's behavior in her parents home, your parents home as well would be awkward because it comes off is very judgmental.
Speaker 2: I you know, I think that approach is spot on, right? I think that's a really good way toe to think about it and also take a deep breath yourself and continue to hold yourself to the standards that you really think are appropriate. So you thought about what you're doing
Speaker 1: 100% and I would also if your parents do actually find this bothers them, and they just don't know how to talk to your sister about it. I would encourage them by saying, This is your house and this is what you've always established with us as good behavior for, you know, dining etiquette and gathering with other people. And it would mean a lot to me if if that could be upheld at this particular house, whatever sister wants to dio you know at her own house is totally fine. But I think that it would be appropriate for the parents to step up to the plate and say, You know, let's name her Gillian, um, Gillian, we really I would appreciate it if you would decide before we sit down at the table whether or not you're going to join us for the whole meal and stay for the evening or if you and let's call him Tommy would like to go off and do your own dinner for the night.
Speaker 2: Sounds really simple and good to May. That dinner table is certainly a time people will carve out for some civility. It can be really important toe, clearly a sister and maybe the parents too. So I really like that language you were just
Speaker 2: putting out there.
Speaker 1: Be. We hope that that helps, and we hope that you can have less stressful meals.
Speaker 1: This question actually begins with quite a lot of lovely praise for us, but I'm going to just not go through okay, I'm going to read it. Sometimes I get worried that we overdo it on reading the praise, but I also it's nice. It's nice to hear it. Definitely don't stop writing it to us once
Speaker 2: an episode. I think it's okay.
Speaker 1: Okay, this one begins. Good morning. I'm going to do that thing where I say how much I love your show because, well, I dio it's so awesome when there's a new one. But then it's sad when it's over. So sorry I love the banter and debate between you two. OK, good. Hopefully you'll love it when it's about your question. I live in Idaho, but I'm originally from South Carolina. I moved here for graduate school and ended up staying. One thing I've noticed is that almost whenever I say anything about etiquette or when I pronounce words a certain way, people will label me as one of those East Coast people I know. Mostly they're just teasing or it's in good fun. But sometimes I feel blown off or made fun of. Who cares how I pronounce Cauliflower Creek or aunt? I'm assuming that it's I don't know how you mispronounced cauliflower, but I'm sure the other two are Creek and Aunt. Um, I don't understand why it's funny in terms of etiquette. If I'm remotely annoyed when people are 10 to 15 minutes late, I've heard oh, quit being such an uptight East coaster. Many people around here tend to run late quite often, but I'm still not used to it. Do I need to chill out? Or is this an opportunity to educate people that could? Etiquette isn't uptight or specific to the East Coast. How do I ask people politely to stop laughing at my pronunciation and asking me to chill out when people are late or don't complete work on time? I'm also concerned because I have a wedding coming up in four months, and I'm concerned people are going to walk in as I'm walking down the aisle and cause a distraction. Is there a way to ask guests to be a few minutes early to give themselves time to find their seats. Or should I just stop micromanaging the situation and just start late? Thanks for reading. Sincerely. Not uptight?
Speaker 2: Well, no, not uptight. When I was in elementary school, they used to call me the 50 year old Man because I was such a serious little person. You
Speaker 1: were a very serious little boy. Mischievous, too, which was not combination, but anyway,
Speaker 2: seriously mischievous. Um,
Speaker 2: e. I don't think it's necessarily just a regional question. There's definitely ah, a little bit of a personality test. I think that that that could sometimes go on when when, Um, lots of different people are meeting and interacting. And clearly you're someone for whom the details matter, things like being on time and pronouncing words properly. And
Speaker 1: I don't even know that she's saying properly. It's more so just the way she grew up, pronouncing them. You know
Speaker 2: it's true because you know, Creek is correct. Some places and Creek is correct. Some
Speaker 1: places, a dictionary says, If you asked how there's this is reminding me
Speaker 2: a little bit of the way we started last week's show talking about regional personalities We're talking about visiting the Midwest and what open and generous person she's talking about the difference between generalizing and stereotyping. It can be really appropriate and effective to think about a group of people collectively and tendencies and preferences. It can help prepare you to interact with the whole culture
Speaker 1: from Psych 101. It's actually how our brains categorize people and make it easier for us to remember. You don't want it to turn bad.
Speaker 2: You don't want to take that generalization and apply it to an individual. That's that's the stereotyping. And here I think that sometimes you feel that the application of those general ideas about East coasters to you as an individual and that that chiefs and and it's reasonable that that chase and I don't think it's appropriate for people to make those kind of comments about you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like you're getting a heavy dose of it. That's unnecessary.
Speaker 2: So I want to acknowledge and address that right off the bat from the from the first part of your question for the secondary part of your question, for really thinking ahead to your wedding, and this is something that's really gonna matter to you clearly does matter to you and you're thinking about it already. I think that's the wise way to think about it. Particularly you anticipate some potential problems. The seriousness of the invitation is going to go a long way towards establishing the expectation of timeliness. A wedding invitation.
Speaker 2: It's something that that that carries some some obligations, some social obligations when people receive it. So I think that you don't need to worry too, too much by getting someone a wedding invitation. You're setting a pretty firm expectation that people arrive on time.
Speaker 1: Actually, people are supposed to arrive half a now, er before the ceremony to do exactly what she is talking about. Find their seat. Say hello to the people. They're gonna be chit chatting with Greek people. Say how happy you are to be here for the day and then you sit down on top of it. Weddings are almost always late for this very reason. Um, the other thing that I would say to her is that it is okay for you to have, um, someone who works at the church that you're getting married at, or someone that you could designate as the person to kind of hold people back from entering during you walking down the aisle or something of the like. And generally someone from the the venue you're getting married at will do that because they understand this is this. This is a really important moment. Is not a moment to be interrupted by someone you know, barging in late and making a ruckus trying to find a seat. Even if they do it quietly, it's still not the time for them to do it. So talk. Talk with the people that are organizing the wedding and the organizer's at the venue where you're actually getting married about that, that you have a big concern about this and you'd like them. Thio, you know, either hold people off or quietly, you know, escort them to a seat
Speaker 2: and and things will happen. Flights will land late. People, I mean,
Speaker 1: get stuck in traffic with
Speaker 2: the best of intentions. Things can go wrong, so it's good to have a backup plan question for you. Wedding etiquette expert Um, what if someone or what? If you're scared that there's a decent percentage of your wedding guest list that aren't aware of the courtesy of showing up a half hour before the announced the ceremony time. Would you ever build a little bit of a cushion into the times that you put on an invitation?
Speaker 1: I think that definitely I think that happens just in general most of the time. I mean, I don't think I've ever been to a wedding that has started on time to begin with. Um, but I also feel like it's it's not a bad idea. Um, it's also not a bad idea. When you send out sort of the little information packet that follows an A wedding invitation to state, You know, it would be a good idea to get to the chapel or to the venue by X time so that you can find your seat and greet people we know traffic is, you know, a lot of weddings are held like at 4. 35 5 30. You know those air heavy traffic hours in a lot of areas. It's not a bad idea to in your information packet that you send out after after the invitation to actually say a reminder like that. I think that's okay.
Speaker 2: Well, up tight, I I hope that helps us faras The wedding goes and as far as the day to day interactions,
Speaker 1: pronunciations and such. Take
Speaker 2: heart. Be yourself. Take it. Take it with a grain of salt if you can.
Speaker 1: Sometimes you can even throw it the other direction Say, Oh, I say Aunt proudly my aunt is not an insect. Um, you know, I think that's one that I got it. Actually, within five minutes at at the cocktail party I was at in Omaha. Ah, someone noticed that I and I do it about 50% of time When I say f a m i l y I pronounce, um the I. And so it's family as opposed to family, where you kind of dropped the eye in the middle. You dropped that that middle syllable. So it's someone noticed it and they're like, You have an accent And I was just sitting here going No, I don't like What are you talking about? You know, everyone thinks their own voices the right voice, and and just chalk this up to they hear it, how they hear it. It sounds different. It's noticeable. It's like when someone
Speaker 2: part of your charm are on
Speaker 1: the end of idea. I'm like, What are you doing? That letter doesn't even exist
Speaker 2: there. But we're in Vermont where it often does
Speaker 1: Vermont, where we get rid of our teas
Speaker 2: and swallow RG
Speaker 1: swallow. Jeez. Sorry. I'm not uptight. We get we get into our own world sometimes. Um, e do think take heart with those. Don't worry about it. I think it's great that you are a punctual person. I don't think you need to be preaching it to everybody. I think you are and have been and should continue to prepare yourself for the fact that the people in the area that you live tend to run about 10 to 15 minutes behind and just run with it.
Speaker 2: Good luck. Enjoy Idaho and best wishes on the coming nuptials.
Speaker 1: And we agree you are not up tight.
Speaker 1: Our
Speaker 2: next listener wants to know Hey, Lizzie and Daniel. I have a friend who I've known for about a year. He talks a lot about himself, what he wants, how great it is to have what he currently owns in small quantities. It would be fine, but he seems to talk about it all the time. We're together. and it really makes it hard to enjoy hanging out with him. How doe. I gently bring this up with him so I can enjoy hanging out with him, or I'd prefer not to have to sit him down and have an intervention. What can I do? Thanks. Soft spoken friend.
Speaker 1: I totally sympathize with you, but I am gonna joke about this one a little bit. I mean, what do you say? Like you're there telling me all about you and your house on the mountain and your sauna. Beautiful. Fianc? And this? No, no, no, I'm not doing that. But then what do I say to you? Do I say, like like, Hey, it's really nice to hear so much about you. Could we talk about me for a minute
Speaker 2: or anything else? But
Speaker 1: anything other than you, like, absolutely
Speaker 2: hard one to deliver. Well, it really is
Speaker 1: our sound engineer. We read this question to him before, and he had such a great one. He goes well enough about me. How do you like my shoes? It's just like
Speaker 1: that's
Speaker 2: something else, right?
Speaker 1: E love it. It is something else. I not sure that this, you know, this happens happens to me when I'm traveling. Or also, um, when I go and eat alone in a place like the person the Barnett, you know at the bar sitting next to you starts talking and they just talk about themselves And you're just like, Do you know how toe answer or ask a question like it happens with dating to you. Get on a date
Speaker 1: and it's polish
Speaker 2: off my resume. Here, run a little interview on
Speaker 1: you're not even an interview. It's like the person just reads you the interview. It's like they just talking about themselves and they never ask you a question about you. And that's when I know I'm never gonna be with this person. I'm like, You don't know how Thio ask about me. You're supposed to try to get to know me. I'm supposed to try to get to know you let me do that work. Let me do the investigative work to get to know you. Um, but this is between two friends. It's clearly a problem. I say Spend less time with him. Um, truthfully, First, I would not bring this up to this person. Personally, I don't think unless you really value this friendship so incredibly much that
Speaker 2: you know them well, have a the repository of good experiences and a long history that in the Friendship Bank that you can draw.
Speaker 1: Even then, I would just really work hard at changing the subject.
Speaker 2: That was the direction I was thinking to take. Also, that that don't don't let yourself get run, run over in the conversation. Persistent. Be prepared to talk about things other things yourself a little bit. But other things topics of common interest. Um, it could really be anything, but but be persistent. And be curious. You can ask questions about things that aren't necessarily related to him and start Tau develops, um, inquiry in your dialogue.
Speaker 1: Oh, you like sailing? Let's talk about a boat you don't own. I'm just kidding. The TV
Speaker 2: show we've both been watching, right?
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: The job that we both share, whatever it might be. But but you do have toe to be persistent about that.
Speaker 1: And truthfully, there are some times where you just realized people maybe aren't the type of friend you wanna have around all the time. It happens all the time. You meet someone you think. Oh, man, this guy's great. Like, it's nice to have a new buddy, you know? And then you get to know him a little bit. Morning. Like, Okay, I don't really want to spend that much time with this person. That's okay, too. If that's what you're discovering with this person, if this isn't gonna be your best friend for life God, father of your Children, like don't worry about it. You can kind of slow down on the amount of time you spend with this person.
Speaker 2: I'll tell you something. Someone once told me about conversation that I really liked hearing was one of the most precious things that you have to share is your story like the story of you, the story of your life, the narrative that you tell yourself about who you are. Abuse? It is one of the most precious things that you have. And be careful with how you share that and how, how freely, Um, how much you put that on other people Put that out there because it really is. It's a precious thing, the narrative of your life, and And think carefully about how you share because you don't want to end up like this person who's who's literally giving a fence and and sending other people away with how, how eager he is to share his particular story.
Speaker 1: So there you go. We don't think that you should actually bring this up to the person and say, You talk about yourself too much. Um, we do think that you should take control of the conversation and try to find other things to direct him towards, and it might be difficult he might constantly be try. Some people are just the type of person that no matter what the subject is, they want to find a way to relate to it.
Speaker 2: Therefore, they talk about
Speaker 1: themselves. Um, and if none of that works, then I say I say slowly, let go of this friendship a bit. Don't spend quite a much time with this person, and that's a hard piece of advice to give. I wish I could give you something better than that, but I in my head cannot find a way to say you
Speaker 2: talk about yourself too much to this person without it
Speaker 1: being too brutal or too difficult, Um, or two offensive. So good luck. Soft spoken friend. We hope that you can find a way to manage this friendship in a way that's positive for you.
Speaker 1: This question begins. Hi, Lizzie and Dan really enjoying the show? So glad that you have expanded. Here's my question of the day. I'm going to be traveling to a conference in New York and will be sharing a rental apartment with a dear friend who is also attending the conference. She has made a plan to meet an acquaintance of hers for dinner, and she has invited me to join them. The acquaintance has picked the dinner location already, however, and unfortunately, when I looked up reviews of the restaurant, they were less than stellar. Theo nly people who are happy about it. We're the ones who are having their bridal showers there. Everyone else seemed to have hated the food, the drinks and the service. Oh, boy, this place is not inexpensive. And given the universe of choices available in New York, it seems a shame to end up there. I feel resigned to just keeping quiet and to enjoy my time with my friend and to anticipate making a good connection with this new acquaintance. It doesn't seem like there's a polite and sensitive alternative, but perhaps you have some ideas. Thanks so much anonymous,
Speaker 2: well anonymous. Being a country boy who loves my visits to the big city. I sympathize with your situation. I like toe optimize every minute and take everything I possibly can out of it, their favorite restaurants in all of the closest cities to me that I would think it just a shame to miss or to end up somewhere bad at the same time. You got to try new things every once in a while. That's how you find your next favorite restaurant. It looks like you've done your due diligence here, and this might not be the spot. Although, as you've noted in the question, you're you're pretty much in a bind here. Your host, the person who's issuing the invitation, is gonna be paying for the meal, really does get to pick where it is that you're gonna eat. I think to send back a A list of suggested alternative options would be just a bit much in this situation.
Speaker 1: I'm guessing that between these people, though, that I don't I bet that this is
Speaker 1: this would be like the kind of dinner where even though this person invited you, I don't think they're gonna pay for it. I think this is like a dinner between friends and acquaintances. And
Speaker 2: so if if that's the case, if Lizzie's assumption is the correct assumption, if this is a meal where you're expecting to split the bill and I say go ahead and offer other other alternatives or options. Um, if this other person is really playing the host role, I would follow their lead and either accept the invitation or not. And if it really matters to you to eat somewhere else or to try something different or something that that you found yourself and could get excited about, then I think you turn down the invitation. If it's a split bill, then then you're talking about you wanna get your your preference and your option on the table a soon as possible. You want to get your choice in the ring so that you can all make a decision.
Speaker 1: All right, I'm going to challenge you a little bit on this one.
Speaker 2: All right, let's
Speaker 1: dio. So I think actually bowing out is a really good option here that if and
Speaker 2: certainly an option,
Speaker 1: it's definitely, I think I think it's definitely an option. It's one that I would feel comfortable telling you. Go ahead and go for it and say, You know, just not feeling that social tonight, you know, travel got to you a little bit. I'm just gonna grab dinner on my own and and you guys have a great time. I don't wanna bring you down that sort of thing. Um, everyone sometimes needs their minute to reset when they're traveling, and this could be your way of asking for that and not making them feel bad. I don't really think it's a total white lies, so I'm okay offering it to you. There's something else that So here's the thing, though, is that when it comes to suggesting something different, it's the acquaintance that this person doesn't know that has asked for the dinner, invited you and then invited you to be a part of their time together. I don't think you as the third party person in this, should be changing. I think the friend could change it. She could say, Hey, Jim, you know I looked up that restaurant and it's not getting great reviews. Would you feel comfortable trying something else? You know, I heard of this place. If she is the one doing it, I think it's one thing. But I think you is the person who doesn't know the person who selected the restaurant. I think it comes across as pushy for you to say. I think it makes it harder steps. So I would either, if you feel comfortable talking to your friend who is gonna be sharing the rental apartment with you about it and let her know that that maybe you were unsure about the restaurant and you had a couple suggestions. That would be one thing. If you don't feel comfortable doing that, I say bow out and go get a dinner someplace that you're gonna enjoy yourself. You
Speaker 2: know, I'll take the Lizzie Post modification to the answer. If you do want to get your input, maybe feed it through that friend. I think that makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 1: Good luck. And we hope you have a great trip to New York. It's one of our favorite places to
Speaker 2: visit. Well, wasn't that better? Look at the effect of a little
Speaker 1: politeness That's it for our questions. For today. As always, we're so incredibly grateful that you listen to our podcast that you have questions of your own to ask, and we want you to keep them coming. Next week, we're gonna have a very special guest. My friend Sharon from modern dating Mastery is going to be on the show with us, and she is gonna be here to answer your dating questions. So please, please, please. Over the next week, send us your dating questions we want to hear. You know, Valentine's Day is coming up. What kind of dating problems do you get into whether you're single, attached, married? You know, what is it that you want to know about dating etiquette? As always, you can submit your questions to awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com. You can also send them in via Facebook and Twitter. Just use the hashtag awesome etiquette so that we know you want your question on
Speaker 2: the show. If you like what you hear, please do tell the world tweeted Facebook it. And of course, you can subscribe on iTunes and do the ever helpful job of leaving us a review. We want to hear from you. You can find us on Facebook. Where? The Emily Post Institute on Twitter. I'm at Daniel Underscore Post
Speaker 1: and I'm at Lizzie a Post. Or you can
Speaker 2: visit our website Emily post dot com Our theme music was and is composed and performed by Bob Wag.