Episode 268 - Honey's Hygiene

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Speaker 1: maybe it's just that you don't know how to use social, could you see that's old fashioned,

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Speaker 1: watch how busy post and they're supposed to act as host and hostess. They know that courtesy means showing respect, thinking of the other person, real friendliness.

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Speaker 2: Hello

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Speaker 1: and welcome to awesome etiquette where

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Speaker 2: we explore modern etiquette through the lens of consideration, respect and honesty. On today's

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Speaker 1: show we take your questions on deflecting work questions, people commenting on your engagement ring, how to talk to honey about hygiene habits and whether or not plastic counts as formal

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Speaker 2: for awesome etiquette sustaining members. We talk about exiting smaller social gatherings without it being awkward

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Speaker 1: plus your most excellent feedback etiquette salute and a postscript segment on travel abroad all that's coming up,

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Speaker 2: awesome etiquette comes to you from the studios of Vermont public radio and is proud to be produced in Burlington Vermont by the Emily Post Institute. I'm lizzie post

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Speaker 1: and I'm dan post sending, I'm

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Speaker 2: back from italy yeah.

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Speaker 1: How do I say hello in italian

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Speaker 2: you did. That's what I said. Yeah, otherwise I always said no because you look great. Thank you. I feel great. This was a really good vacation.

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Speaker 1: So you feel good inside and you look good on the outside.

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Speaker 2: Ah yeah, keep the compliments coming. Yes I do. I feel good on the inside too. I am filled with amazing italian food and really beautiful views for the past 12 days straight. So I am very good on the inside to know but I did. I came back with a whole like recipe catalog. I don't even know but there's a lot of recipes in my brain from this trip. Food was definitely the feature of it and from home cooked meals with the family whose villa we stay at,

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Speaker 2: the family that that lives there and owns the place hosted a big sunday dinner for us or big sunday lunch for us. Which was like all these different fish dishes and it was incredible. And then they also hosted a lovely dinner for my cousin's birthday.

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Speaker 2: Um She was traveling with us and it was just this beautiful home cooked meal on the first night we got in, they hosted us for dinner. So I was like, I got all these great home cooked meals to, you know well.

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Speaker 1: And I know your father is a big fan of food in the region. He's a nice host to be touring with. I know you do a cooking school, but

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Speaker 2: I did with chef Claudio is awesome. Oh my gosh, I learned so much.

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Speaker 1: I can't let this conversation get away from me. I also have to wish you a happy birthday. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize it was a double birthday trip.

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Speaker 2: Yes. Caroline was born on the 11th and I was the 18th. So yes, I got to spend my birthday in Rome, which was really fun. Okay.

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Speaker 1: Okay. But we digress back to the food.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the food. It was unbelievable.

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Speaker 2: We went to towns like Lommel, which is way up in the mountains. That was some of the best food of the whole trip. It was just incredible. I ate meat on this trip. I said, I'm just going to enjoy everything. That sounds right to me and it was great. I was very glad I did. I'm also very glad to be home. Like looking at my cupboards with my usual vegetarian fare. My cousin ordered this ravioli that was pairs and

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Speaker 2: ricotta in the middle and then this pecorino with a little bit of pepper. Um, and it wasn't quite like a Casio pepe, but it was, it was like just wonderfully light flavors and yet the pecorino was really strong. So

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Speaker 2: I never got, it was really delicate and it just all balanced beautifully and it just made you so happy that you were eating food. I

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Speaker 1: think I could follow about 80% of that and it just sounds awesome. I

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Speaker 2: know, I apologize. I could wax poetic about food the entire time. But,

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Speaker 2: but we visited some beautiful towns. So we went to Lommel and we went to Grieve

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Speaker 2: and we went to san Cassiano, which is one of my favorites. We also stopped in Orvieto on our way down. That was probably my favorite town of the whole trip.

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Speaker 2: Beautiful, beautiful church in the middle

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Speaker 2: of this big square, just gorgeous frescoes on the inside, amazing carvings on the doors on the outside that like, you know, told, told the stories I think of genesis and

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Speaker 2: so it was just, it was incredible and the shopping in that town was fantastic. Like every story you walked into, you saw cool stuff and then you looked at the price tag and went, well wait a minute, I can afford that, that's wonderful feeling.

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Speaker 1: And this is where all my antenna go up here on my arm because you do, you look great, your fashion God,

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Speaker 2: yeah, I did, I totally, I went, I had done a lot of clearing out of the old wardrobe and on this trip I specifically said like I'm going to, I'm going to let some of the fashion inspire me and like

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Speaker 2: come back and kind of revamp my wardrobe and it was really nice to find ways to do that on vacation and be budget friendly for me because it could, you know, you can overdo it, you can get excited, you can get into the swing of things and the next thing, you know, you're regretting it later and I was really proud to not do that in his eyes,

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Speaker 2: but to come back with some pieces that I really, really, really happy with, Some things look

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Speaker 1: great on vacation. Yeah, they don't

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Speaker 2: translate. Yeah, especially like european fashion can definitely not really, or let's just say it could stand out in Vermont, I'm

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Speaker 1: thinking of that Hawaiian shirt, The Panama shirt looks great at a certain latitude but back in

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Speaker 2: Vermont

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Speaker 2: but no, it was, it was a beautiful trip, it was wonderful to spend time with my parents and my cousin who moved away about five years ago, but who anna and I grew up with and so it was really great to see her and she's engaged and so it's fun to celebrate her engagement with her and

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Speaker 2: it was really a fantastic vacation. I did have a dreaded etiquette issue though. Oh

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Speaker 1: no,

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Speaker 2: that was that my auto reply did go out because you sent me emails and you do and I checked and you said you were getting them and I did have one set of emails that went through

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Speaker 2: that I needed to address. And so I got that and I noticed my own auto reply going out, but there was one person who was trying to file a story and he wasn't getting the auto reply and I was like, okay, well I got a phone call and I was like, okay, well I'll just text him back because the

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Speaker 2: phone was showing me I had the option to text only. It turned out he had called from his home phone. So he never got my message that said, hey,

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Speaker 2: I'm actually on vacation, I'll be able to read this on the 22nd. And he had these messages that were like, I'm kind of worried like this seems unlike you, like, you know, and luckily there, you know, we've now reconnected but it was that classic etiquette issue of just like, I'm not actually ignoring you, but you wouldn't know that because all signs point to I'm ignoring you.

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Speaker 2: There was just no, no making that one work. We got caught in a technology trapped there.

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Speaker 1: Well, welcome

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Speaker 2: home. Thank you. I know. Back to email. Back to work

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Speaker 1: and I'm just going to assume it all resolves well that you're going to say the right thing at the right moment and all will be forgiven because there's nothing to

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Speaker 2: forgive. But it's all the emails are all jovial and good and we connected. So it's good.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, it is funny. You're, but it's like you just jump right back into solving problems, making things happen, finding out what's going on.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'm looking forward to hearing more about italy. Yes,

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Speaker 1: but speaking of jumping in

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Speaker 2: Oh, I know we need, we do need to get to some questions, don't we? I feel like I'm still on vacation. Sorry, we'll

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Speaker 1: be

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Speaker 2: gentle. Let's

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Speaker 1: do it,

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Speaker 1: awesome etiquette is here to answer your questions on how to behave. If you have a question for us, you can email it to awesome etiquette at Emily Post dot com or leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind that's 8028585463 on twitter. We are at Emily Post institute

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Speaker 1: on instagram. We are at Emily Post institute and on facebook, we are awesome etiquette

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Speaker 1: just use the hashtag awesome etiquette with your social media posts so that we know you want your question on the show and sustaining members. Remember to put sustaining members somewhere in your message will answer your questions on the sustaining member site from a smaller pool of questions and you can also access and adds free version of the show with all your bonus questions.

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Speaker 1: Okay.

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Speaker 1: Mhm.

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Speaker 2: Mhm.

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Speaker 2: Mhm.

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Speaker 2: Our first question is titled,

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Speaker 2: What do you do? Don't

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Speaker 1: hi lizzie and dan, my husband doesn't like small talk and he especially hates it when people ask him about his job. He has been at this job for five years. He makes more money. We live in a better area closer to family and overall our family is doing great. But his job is hard, he has a senior position and it has taken a lot of work to change the culture in the workplace and there is still a lot of work to do.

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Speaker 1: Last night we met with some friends from where we used to live. They asked him about his job and he struggled to come up with an answer. He would like to say I don't want to talk about it but I feel like that would make the question asked her feel so uncomfortable.

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Speaker 1: I think he should come up with a pat throw away answer like it has its challenges but we love the area, he feels like that is being untruthful when you ask a tear to question, should you expect a more controversial answer. Love the show best Denise.

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Speaker 2: I love how Denise is posing this, that it's like, so because it

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Speaker 2: it reminds me of all the times dan on the show where you talk about,

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Speaker 2: you can enter into a space but you might not be able to expect a certain level of it's like this from your you go finish it off for me. I just don't. It's like, it's really interesting to kind of think of it that way. Like wow, if you start talking about more serious things, should we be expecting potentially more?

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Speaker 2: He did opinionated, You know, assertive answers in response and, and I don't know, pick other adjectives, whatever else you want to add in there. But it's a really interesting question Denise and I think while we're always

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Speaker 2: hoping to

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Speaker 2: ensure a quality of conversation that makes everybody comfortable,

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Speaker 2: I think that when you do enter into those higher tiers, the rejection of the question itself for the ability of the other person to not part there you go, willingness of the other person to not participate. I think it's an option that I think rises a bit more to the top than when you say,

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Speaker 2: hey, how's the weather in your hometown? You know, it's like if someone said, I will not answer that. Yeah, there's going to be a little bit awkward. But when someone, you know, asks you about your job, I think it's fair to assume that some people are going to answer with.

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Speaker 2: I got to be honest, I'd love to not talk about work, but tell me what you guys are up to the next weekend or where'd you go on your last vacation? You know? And again, redirecting that conversation, there are times you and I don't want to talk about work, their doctors right into us all the time, like, oh gosh, when I go to a party and I

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Speaker 2: say I'm a doctor in whatever specialty I'm in or just the questions start flowing. But what do you think you think the risk gets higher that the question itself might be rejected?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely. And I do think it's okay.

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Speaker 1: I've got to take a huge step back and just applaud, sort of acknowledge my glow when I hear someone reference a Tier two conversation topic because this is our internal language here on the show. Tier two topics of conversation to review, religion, politics, dating or your love life. They're potentially more controversial topics and

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Speaker 1: we don't

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Speaker 1: usually think of work as being a Tier two topic. It's a pretty common question to ask someone particularly America. Not so much in europe. What do you do

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Speaker 1: relatively early in an interaction or relationship?

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Speaker 1: It's almost two or three because it almost has to do with

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Speaker 2: money. Just going to say, it's kind of like saying how do you make your money,

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Speaker 1: family or finance? Really intimate topics of conversation.

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Speaker 2: Do you have any kids? Whoa! As

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Speaker 1: we're climbing those tears, I do think you take some risks if you start to probe the topic a little bit and

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Speaker 1: we generally say the advice is that you don't ask a probing question unless someone's opened the door that you enter those conversations with more general statements with less sort of requests for personal information

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Speaker 1: and if someone's coming at you like that, I think it's okay to

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Speaker 1: as our question Askar suggests, have a kind of pat answer something that's relatively light and truthful and most people who are bringing up these topics are whether they realize it or not, going to be looking for a little cues from you about how deep this dive is going to get or whether or not you're comfortable or willing to do this. And

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Speaker 1: oftentimes that first line of defense that

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Speaker 1: rehearsed answer that essentially deflects but also indicates that I'm not particularly interested in going further is going to be enough. And I do like the idea of keeping some good humor about it because it's not an uncommon question for people to ask.

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Speaker 1: If someone asks a more personal question that's less common. That's catching me off guard that I can't anticipate as much. I'm also going to make a little more room offer a little more latitude on that response. Being maybe surprisingly blunt.

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Speaker 1: Oh boy, I don't like to talk about that once

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Speaker 1: I've got in my car and driven home for the day and turn on a podcast,

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Speaker 2: whatever leave work at work, boy, otherwise it follows me everywhere, or

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Speaker 1: if it really catches you off guard, just oh, I'm not comfortable talking about that is an ok response. It's not great. And it does put the question asked her on the spot a little bit. That's the other part of this question that I love is this awareness of the person who's asking the question and a

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Speaker 1: a concern being shown without awareness about how that person

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Speaker 2: feels. And that's where we have to remember that it's so easy to solve that problem that you've now created, right? Because we're like creating a problem to solve a problem in some ways with this one. And the nice thing is, is just like in our five steps, I feel like the step of refinement would come in here

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Speaker 2: because your refinement is

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Speaker 2: that you carry the conversation somewhere else so that you're not leaving the other person hanging there. Having felt like they asked an awkward question, but really they're wondering, wait, what was so awkward about that? Instead, you're you're guiding it to a different spot and you're letting them know you want to engage in conversation with them that

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Speaker 2: this is it's time to enjoy, you just didn't want to talk about work.

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Speaker 2: And I think that that's perfectly permissible given that we are so not that we dish out permission, but like, you know, I think that that's an okay thing for us to expect from each other that there are topics we sometimes just don't want to talk about like the same with your kids. Sometimes someone asking how your kids are doing and you're like,

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Speaker 2: I don't want to talk about my kids tantrums on a regular

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Speaker 1: basis. It's kind of hard to

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Speaker 2: travel, getting too smart for me.

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Speaker 1: In this particular case,

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Speaker 1: you could talk about the move, you could talk about the new area, maybe you don't want to talk about work, but you wouldn't mind having a tier three conversation about kids and what it's like having kids here or what it was like going through a move with kids. You can give indications about where you would like that conversation to go and having those interests, those

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Speaker 1: cultivated

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Speaker 1: curiosities about life that you can share and engage with

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Speaker 1: are going to be your best friends as you move away from this topic that you don't want to necessarily talk about

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Speaker 2: as a final point. I do think that feeling like you can disengage from a topic is really empowering in a conversation and it's funny how once you exercise it a couple times, whether it goes well or not, sometimes you actually then find you don't need to exercise it,

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Speaker 2: like quite as bluntly as you thought you needed to, you know, or you just feel like, okay, now I would be comfortable kind of saying

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Speaker 2: like side stepping it a bit or saying it's, you know, it's a job, but I'm so happy we're in this area, you know, and feeling like that's actually truthful as opposed to untruthful. So as you kind of exercise out

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Speaker 2: making this work for you, I think you might also find yourself going through different stages, you know,

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Speaker 2: Denise, this is an awesome question, thank you so much and best of luck to navigating these social situations in this conversation.

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Speaker 1: Will you enjoy this special evening among your friends? Will you really have a good time

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Speaker 1: or will you be a little unsure, a little uncertain about the right thing to do in the right time to do it.

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Speaker 1: Our next question is called the family stone

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Speaker 2: Hi lizzie and dan. I'm a longtime listener but a first time question Askar of the show. I first discovered awesome etiquette early in college and then rediscovered it a few years into the real world.

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Speaker 2: I love listening to the show and love your advice and the way it consistently reminds me to take a considerate, respectful and honest approach to any situation I run into.

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Speaker 2: I'm recently engaged and my ring features a center stone that belonged to both my grandmother and great grandmother. The ring, in my opinion, is absolutely beautiful and I love that my fiance was able to use this very special stone to create a new ring that's unique to us.

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Speaker 2: I was also very close to my grandmother and lost her recently. So the ring is extra special and is a way to keep her close.

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Speaker 2: However, my ring is bigger than it would have been had my mother not given my fiance this family stone.

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Speaker 2: Some reactions have been more reserved, but we've also gotten quite a range of reactions and outbursts about its size.

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Speaker 2: This makes me feel really awkward and at this point I usually get the urge to quickly explain the story behind the ring, but when I go that route,

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Speaker 2: I sometimes feel like I'm saying, don't worry, he didn't pay for it, which also doesn't seem fair to my fiance. He definitely invested a lot emotionally and financially into this ring and I didn't want to take that away from him.

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Speaker 2: My question is, what's the most appropriate and gracious way to respond to comments like this? I love the story of the ring, but am I putting my fiance down by jumping in with my explanation too quickly.

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Speaker 2: Thanks in advance for all your help. Anonymous

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Speaker 1: anonymous. Thank you for your question and welcome back. We're so glad that you found the show and that you've also found a way to re engage with it in a different place and time in your life. That is awesome,

00:19:03

Speaker 1: Congratulations. This is a big moment in life and there will be lots of changes coming and some changes already.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't in your pocket, but they're actually on your

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Speaker 2: hand

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Speaker 1: and that ring is a real symbol of this, this change in life. And it's not unusual to get used to people reacting and responding to it and figuring out how you in turn respond to those reactions and that appreciation.

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Speaker 1: Big picture thought

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Speaker 1: don't feel awkward. This is a lovely problem to have. It's a real treat to be able to wear that family stone to be able to find a new setting for it that you really feel reflects you and your current situation, your fiance,

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Speaker 1: but also to carry that tradition forward. So big picture, I just want to say,

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Speaker 1: enjoy the moment, enjoy wearing that, that family heirloom and the rest will fall into place. We're going to figure out a good way for you to respond to that. Do you have some good

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Speaker 2: language, congratulations, Everything's wonderful lizzie answer the question. Thanks dan.

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Speaker 2: You're really getting me right back to work here.

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Speaker 2: Um, I think that this is a really common worry from the person wearing the ring, whereas I think the people around you don't assume such things as often as you might think everyone knows there are a few people who think this way, you will notice that kind of a thing and the polite thing to do is ignore that.

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Speaker 2: And so I think that

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Speaker 2: whether you want to tell the story or not should come from whether they're asking about the ring like, oh, is it something you made or did you have a family stone? Very common question. I mean it sounds really nosy when you actually think about what they're asking and the things that you can learn from what they're asking. But

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Speaker 2: I think that one of the important things to remember is that just because you've used this big beautiful family stone doesn't mean your fiance couldn't have afforded a different stone. And you know, you talk about the sentimentality especially for having just lost your grandmother, which was so sorry to hear that,

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Speaker 2: but that to me, almost suggests that this

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Speaker 2: is why this is better, more important, more wonderful, more special. It's just more and more and more and more and more and so I don't think that anyone listening to you talk about that would turn around and think, oh, he couldn't afford more, like, you know, he had to lean on the family. I just don't think that's where

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Speaker 2: the brain goes

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Speaker 2: for most of the people listening to your story,

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Speaker 1: I can feel the genuine connection to that family history,

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Speaker 1: grandmother to great grandmother. And I'm pretty sure that's going to come through, particularly when I hear you

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Speaker 1: reference and awareness of the kind of picture it paints about your fiance. Just having that much awareness in your mind is going to help you avoid

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Speaker 1: any language that

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Speaker 1: might feel a little coarse or harsh and start to put that kind of a spin on it. I wouldn't count on other people bringing that counting carrots spin and as long as your

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Speaker 1: not projecting that into the situation, I think you're going to be in pretty good shape. I almost don't feel like you need an alternate sample script. I think that you can trust yourself and trust your good taste in explaining your enthusiasm for the ring, your fiance,

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Speaker 1: this whole exciting moment in your life.

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Speaker 2: You know, this goes the other way to

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Speaker 2: I know tons of people who, you know, could certainly afford whatever ring they wish from a shop, but they choose something simple or they choose a non traditional stone or they do a tattoo and that there are lots of different ways that engagement rings and wedding bands are special to people other than

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Speaker 2: the diamond. That's our classic diamond and having lots of diamonds and bigger and better diamonds. And

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Speaker 2: I think we get a lot of that pressure from all the entertainment that we watch, that focuses on the story of getting engaged and getting married and you know, a lot of that is because you need to be able to see the ring in a story in a fictional tale. And so it's got to be big to be able to see it on camera. Well, it just doesn't indicate that someone couldn't afford something better

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Speaker 2: or anything about their personality or how seriously they take getting engaged just because they have a different type of ring too.

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Speaker 2: The final thought that I have is in terms of people making big outbursts or exclamations about the size of the center stone. That that is something you just kinda have to get used to in some ways, I don't know that there's a way to politely tell someone, wow, that makes me really uncomfortable that you were that excited about how big this stone is.

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Speaker 2: Like I don't, I just, I haven't found the right in my head version of that

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Speaker 2: home

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Speaker 2: and so I think just don't feel that you then have to talk about where it came from. You can just simply say thanks. It is, it's really, I was really surprised. It's really beautiful or you know that stone actually comes from my grandmother and I'm so proud to have it on my finger. Those can be ways to kind of give, give a little bit of information without them making it

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Speaker 2: anything other than what you've said

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Speaker 1: in response to any compliment. Thank you so much, truly are magic words

00:24:34

Speaker 1: anonymous. Thank you so much for this question. Good luck with the rest of the wedding planning. We know it's going to be a smashing success

00:24:43

Speaker 1: and whatever you do wherever you go, you want to put your best foot forward.

00:24:55

Speaker 1: Our next question is delightfully titled honeys hygiene.

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Speaker 1: Dear lizzie and dan, many thanks for your podcast. I have a two part question for you. How can one romantic partner q another to change their hygiene habits without giving offense.

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Speaker 1: I have the habit of washing my hands whenever I return from worker errands, my partner doesn't have this habit and will sometimes not think to do so before sitting to share a meal. We are new to living together and I don't want to come across as a control freak. But I'd really like to have a house policy of washing hands upon returning home.

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Speaker 1: My second hygiene question regards tooth brushing. My partner never has bad breath, but I noticed often comes to bed without brushing. If you could help me come up with some graceful ways to address these issues, I'd really appreciate it.

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Speaker 1: Shelly

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Speaker 2: who this one is so tough.

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Speaker 1: I want to put this one in the etiquette, classic category.

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Speaker 2: I want to put this in the etiquette. I don't want to have to answer in category. Personal hygiene questions. They are the hardest ones and they are the hardest ones for the clients that we work with to bring up.

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Speaker 2: And often we hear that even when they try to talk about this, well it still goes badly and it's one of the pieces of advice we give when we say if you're going to address this, don't expect it to go well,

00:26:18

Speaker 2: expect someone's feelings to be hurt, expect for someone to have an emotional reaction first and maybe a practical reaction later

00:26:25

Speaker 1: or expect them to hear you

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Speaker 1: and then not change

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Speaker 2: which change and be mad at you for having brought it up at all. I mean this is it, this is this is not a fun one. And we like to on the flip side tell people who receive this information to understand that it's probably coming from a good place that at the end of the day, if you ask yourself, do I want to smell or appear like I don't take care of myself cleanly. I think that most of us would say, yeah, no, I don't want to be in that category. And that the times in life where we might have not cared about being in that category were times that were tough times probably. And so for us, you know, that cleanliness that

00:27:09

Speaker 2: um that that keeping things hygienic is really a part of taking care of ourselves as we are participating in a society together. And I think that that's

00:27:19

Speaker 2: an interesting question when we're questioning that

00:27:23

Speaker 2: and I think it really gets at people and it's why people feel really offended to hear it. And I think you have some agency and I think you don't and we're talking about,

00:27:32

Speaker 2: you know here Shelly wants to be asking her partner to wash hands every time they come home.

00:27:38

Speaker 2: And I'm guessing that we're going to include before mealtimes as well in there. And then also to make sure teeth are actually brushed before coming to bed

00:27:48

Speaker 2: and this is something you're going to have to work out with your partner and each partnership is going to be a little bit different. And some might say, oh my gosh, I could totally ask that of my partner and expect them to adhere to it. And someone else might say I asked, but

00:28:03

Speaker 2: they kept forgetting and I had to get over it. And for someone else, the ask in and of itself is an overstep

00:28:09

Speaker 2: and maybe you have to have the conversation about,

00:28:14

Speaker 2: do we have agency with each other to have conversation about our personal hygiene habits and you might want to have that dan. And I have had this conversation about smelly clothing because closet smell is something he can't pick up on and I, I pick up on it really quickly. So I'm like, dude, your clothing smells today.

00:28:32

Speaker 2: And we've come up with solutions for how to fix it for when it happens. But my clothes started doing it and I actually tested it while I was away and I put sachets with lavender and peppermint and lemon in my and it worked. So I was like, great, this this dresser that I got. That turned out to kind of be a smelly dresser is workable

00:28:52

Speaker 1: and our audience should know that just yesterday you were telling me how to put together these little packets.

00:28:56

Speaker 2: Yes, I said, listen, hey, I did something and it works. So I want to get you started on

00:29:00

Speaker 1: this. You just alluded to something that I oftentimes tell people when I'm talking about how to resolve these kinds of issues and that's that you're my person who have given permission to talk to me about personal hygiene issues because I want to know

00:29:14

Speaker 2: longhairs, boogers, broccoli in the tooth, smelly nous. I'll take

00:29:20

Speaker 1: a risk, dandruff,

00:29:22

Speaker 2: dandruff and coffee breath.

00:29:24

Speaker 2: Coffee breath has like ended working relationships. I feel like

00:29:29

Speaker 1: I find it really valuable to have people in my life who will help me with these things. Often times we're not aware of the lapses in our own personal hygiene or where our standards for our own hygiene don't conform with other people's standards.

00:29:42

Speaker 1: Oftentimes these are unintentional,

00:29:45

Speaker 1: uh differences or rudeness is, or transgressions that aren't registering with the person who's doing them. So, having that accountability that check on the outside

00:29:56

Speaker 1: can be so valuable

00:29:58

Speaker 1: how you hear. It

00:30:00

Speaker 1: is hard and there are things that can make it easier and no matter who it is, whether it's a very intimate partnership, whether it's a familial relationship that's not as intimate, whether it's a professional relationship, asking permission to have that conversation is one way to start to figure out if you have the agency or the authority to have the conversation,

00:30:20

Speaker 1: You can ask, you can say something like there's something a little awkward that I've been wanting to talk to you about would now be a good time.

00:30:28

Speaker 1: Oh, and maybe it's like a little bit of a trepidatious. Oh, but

00:30:32

Speaker 2: you've also given that

00:30:35

Speaker 1: person some opportunity to prepare themselves, even if it's momentarily, you've also

00:30:40

Speaker 1: giving them the option of opting out. No, I'm not having a great day to day. This would not be the best time.

00:30:47

Speaker 1: Oh, that doesn't sound great. But yeah, let's

00:30:49

Speaker 2: do it. Can we talk about it later? Okay.

00:30:52

Speaker 1: Now you have permission to say the thing. You have to be ready.

00:30:56

Speaker 1: Also negotiate to listen to hear the other person to table it and come back to it later. Let them

00:31:02

Speaker 2: react badly. You

00:31:03

Speaker 1: have to be willing to be direct to be clear about what it is that you're talking about

00:31:08

Speaker 1: when I read this question and I hear lizzie go through that list. There's the return home the before meal and the brushing before bed.

00:31:16

Speaker 1: I might separate those two conversations. I might have a hand washing conversation or a tooth brushing conversations.

00:31:23

Speaker 2: I put in my vote, I would have a conversation first about whether or not we as romantic partners are willing to be this person for each other to make these asks of each other.

00:31:35

Speaker 2: I think that's unless you know it already. I think that's the place to start

00:31:40

Speaker 2: and to say, you know, hey, I'm just in, in living together. I've noticed that we have some different habits and I wanted to know if it's something that we can actually talk about with each other

00:31:52

Speaker 2: or if they're potentially just kind of no go areas of territory like thing. It's things like washing hands and brushing teeth. And

00:32:00

Speaker 2: I just didn't know if we had agency to talk to each other about that kind of stuff and you're indicating that it's been on your mind, like, and be honest about that. Let that be okay. So, you know,

00:32:11

Speaker 2: I noticed we've never talked about it or that we do things differently. And I just wanted to give us the space to talk about that if we wanted to,

00:32:19

Speaker 2: they might have things about you. You never know. Like, you know,

00:32:24

Speaker 1: definitely be ready to listen and to hear responses that aren't going to be the

00:32:31

Speaker 1: responses that you're expecting going in and

00:32:35

Speaker 1: along with that mental preparation

00:32:38

Speaker 1: to listen, to negotiate to be willing to table something.

00:32:43

Speaker 1: I also find it's often useful to set extreme boundaries for yourself. Say

00:32:49

Speaker 1: what's the best possible outcome I could get? Oh, my partner says, please tell me anything. I'll change

00:32:53

Speaker 2: anything you want and apply myself

00:32:56

Speaker 1: to 1000% until I accomplish

00:32:58

Speaker 2: it literally just been waiting for someone to tell me to do this. This is wonderful. Thank you,

00:33:02

Speaker 1: sweetheart. And you might hear that I've been meaning to brush my teeth before bed ever since I was a little kid

00:33:07

Speaker 2: reminder. Let's do it together.

00:33:09

Speaker 1: Yeah, best possible outcome. Worst possible outcome. I disagree with you entirely about every standard that you're articulating. Now. I'm not going to change the way I do things and that's not okay with you. I'm prepared to move

00:33:23

Speaker 2: out. Yeah, I was going to say, I'm questioning this relationship like that, it's a possibility.

00:33:28

Speaker 1: Not likely, but just saying to yourself, okay, this is one end of the spectrum, this is the other because that other end of the spectrum, that worst possible outcome lets you say to yourself, is this a relationship extinction event? Is it something that I would be willing to walk away from this over

00:33:44

Speaker 2: does not where I thought you were going with, I don't think

00:33:47

Speaker 1: you're going to go there. But having said that to yourself all of a sudden we're deconstructing this whole problem and stripping away a lot of the anc's,

00:33:55

Speaker 2: it's the safety of the walk out knowing that it would be okay, you would survive. You know that you can go in and

00:34:02

Speaker 1: find the middle ground, that's the more likely outcome,

00:34:04

Speaker 2: right? That's what I thought you were going to get to, just like because you look at that and it makes you see how unlikely that is and you feel better about having a simple conversation, but no dan goes or it could really happen

00:34:18

Speaker 1: acknowledging the possibility makes it less

00:34:20

Speaker 2: likely. I I totally agree with you. I totally agree with you Shelly, thank you for giving us the opportunity to address such just a delicate topic. It's one that I think you could substitute all different kinds of habits, action standards into it. And a lot of people are experiencing this or having these little thoughts of, Should I bring this up. Should I not?

00:34:43

Speaker 2: And one of the hardest things when it comes to this type of etiquette question is that it really so depends on the two people involved.

00:34:51

Speaker 2: So what we really like to offer is the courage to find the avenue to open the conversation or to realize you don't want to go down it. That's another option too. But it's really important to be considering the two of you and your

00:35:08

Speaker 2: goals and having the conversation and also what part of your relationship, Whether or not you think you can handle it or not?

00:35:16

Speaker 1: Make those conversation goals explicit. I care about us. I care about this relationship, I care about you and I living together well and feeling comfortable with each other. Don't assume those things are understood, make them an explicit part of the discussion. And then

00:35:31

Speaker 1: anything else that you say, any other butts or ans that are part of that

00:35:37

Speaker 1: trickier conversation are going to be understood in that

00:35:41

Speaker 1: broader context of those good goals.

00:35:45

Speaker 1: Good luck. Let us know how it goes. I'd be really curious to hear how this turns out. Being clean, gives you a sense of well being. You actually feel better, more alive when you know you are clean all over your cleanliness makes you more attractive to other people.

00:36:03

Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:36:04

Speaker 2: Our fourth question is titled plastic formal.

00:36:08

Speaker 2: Hello. I was given an old delicate crochet tablecloth.

00:36:12

Speaker 2: It would be meaningful to the person who gave it to me if I used it. This thanksgiving.

00:36:17

Speaker 2: She suggested that I use a clear plastic covering over it.

00:36:21

Speaker 2: To me, the plastic covering at a formal dining room table feels cheap and takes away from the beauty of the silver china and crystal.

00:36:30

Speaker 2: I'm not sure if there is a formal, right or wrong answer to using the clear plastic covering or if it's a personal preference thing. I'm interested in your opinion. Either way, thank you so very much sincerely Cheryl

00:36:43

Speaker 1: Cheryl. I'm going to

00:36:45

Speaker 1: give you a very frank answer.

00:36:47

Speaker 2: I'm dying to

00:36:48

Speaker 1: hear this.

00:36:50

Speaker 1: I don't like the idea of the plastic. I do think it interferes with an aesthetic of formality, of special occasion that you're really looking for. And

00:37:00

Speaker 1: the reason that I sort of feel like it's almost a risk or frank to say that is it's an aesthetic choice. It's not necessarily an etiquette choice. It's about a personal preference and a look and feel that you're creating

00:37:13

Speaker 1: at the same time as a host. That's one of the things you get to do, or that is for many people, the pleasure or enjoyment of setting a table and presenting a meal or hosting.

00:37:25

Speaker 1: So I do think as a host, you've

00:37:27

Speaker 1: got some latitude to base your decisions on aesthetic choices,

00:37:32

Speaker 1: how you do that, How you take care of the feelings of the person that lent or gave you this tablecloth, but also gave you some instructions that said, care for it in these ways matters.

00:37:44

Speaker 1: And you can weigh your aesthetic choices in. But you also want to balance those against that request, who it came from and why it was made. And that's where the

00:37:53

Speaker 1: etiquette answer. Part of this question comes into play.

00:37:56

Speaker 2: It's like the different avenues make me think different things. One you could just simply not use the tablecloth at all. And when this person asks that thanksgiving say,

00:38:05

Speaker 2: you know, I just really didn't feel comfortable using the plastic covering and I was too nervous to use it without the plastic covering. So I decided to go with something where I wouldn't be nervous about how it was going to work all night long.

00:38:19

Speaker 2: And that's fair enough thing to tell somebody you are the host. This is simply a suggestion. I think those are good things to remind yourself of. I don't know how serious the plastic covering warning was. If you could maybe say, you know, I was really comfortable using using the tablecloth without it.

00:38:36

Speaker 2: And if it's I mean you mentioned it's delicate. I don't know how delicate it is.

00:38:40

Speaker 2: You know, we do see lots of beautiful table settings. There are competitions all all around the country for table. So it was just really, really cool. But we see beautiful table settings with very delicate, you know, lace and crochet and um embroidery and things on them. And

00:38:58

Speaker 2: it's something that we warn people of when they use their nice elements is that they could get ruined and we take that risk.

00:39:06

Speaker 2: You know, it

00:39:07

Speaker 1: gets broken, the

00:39:08

Speaker 2: lipstick gets on the it's like it happens and I think we we assume that risk when we choose to bring beautiful, delicate things into our lives. So

00:39:19

Speaker 2: I think the question of whether or not you use it but ignore the direction of the plastic is so dependent on your relationship with this person and

00:39:27

Speaker 2: whether you feel that's a risk you can take with the item you've been given and given instructions with and that's that's why I don't go the route of just saying like do that and then explain to them why you did it. It's an option. But I think I think I would go with the other two personally over that option. I think that's a that's a slightly dicey one.

00:39:47

Speaker 2: I think it also really is dependent upon the actual delicate nous of this item and whether or not this is just someone being way overly cautious. My one like maybe go both ways. Thing is could you you know, display it

00:40:03

Speaker 2: by like draping it over a dowel so that you're not putting any nails in it to hang it on a wall or something

00:40:10

Speaker 2: and and having it somewhere in the house so that it is out. Maybe there is something incredibly special about it and that would be an alternative that I would then explain and just say look, I wasn't comfortable putting the plastic on the table and instead I thought it would be really nice to display the tablecloth like this so that it's a part of everything

00:40:30

Speaker 2: but that I didn't have to use the plastic

00:40:32

Speaker 1: and of course the final option,

00:40:34

Speaker 1: you could say I'm going to take the aesthetic hit, I'm going to use the plastic just this one time and

00:40:41

Speaker 1: so and so will really appreciate it because that's what they

00:40:44

Speaker 2: asked. It is totally an option as well.

00:40:47

Speaker 1: Best of luck planning the rest of this thanksgiving meal. We hope it goes well.

00:40:51

Speaker 1: You're worried about not doing the right thing. Your table manners now you're talking like mom and dad. Look,

00:40:58

Speaker 1: you may not care much about table manners now, but when you grow up to be me then you'll care.

00:41:04

Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:41:05

Speaker 1: Mhm.

00:41:07

Speaker 1: Mhm.

00:41:08

Speaker 1: Thank you for your questions. Please send us updates, comments or feedback on our answers to awesome etiquette at Emily Post dot com. Or leave us a voicemail or text at 80285 A kind that's 8028585463 on instagram. We are at Emily Post institute and on facebook we are awesome etiquette

00:41:26

Speaker 1: on twitter we are at Emily post inst just use the hashtag awesome etiquette in your post so that we know you want your question on the show.

00:41:34

Speaker 1: Mhm

00:41:36

Speaker 2: it's time for our feedback segment where we hear from you about the questions we answer in the topics we cover, and today we hear about episode 2 64 and the toilet seat up or down at work question

00:41:48

Speaker 1: Dear lizzie and dan. I would like to add a perspective to the classic toilet seat up down discussion. I believe the greatest you factor is the down toilet seat that has been the target of a p miss by someone with boy parts. As you so elegantly put it

00:42:04

Speaker 1: granted this risk should be smaller in an office than in a bar, but to minimize the you of this occurrence isn't the seat up position also of advantage for the sitting users of the toilet. Best henning in Mannheim Germany.

00:42:18

Speaker 2: That's an interesting perspective, the idea that but the seat up

00:42:22

Speaker 2: more often means that the actual seat isn't getting any splash or spray on it

00:42:29

Speaker 2: as an interesting perspective,

00:42:30

Speaker 1: but I think that

00:42:31

Speaker 1: idea is that each

00:42:34

Speaker 1: person who would be standing up would lift it and then put it back when they're done. So they're responsible for

00:42:41

Speaker 2: making sure that seat stays unsparing. Khaled.

00:42:44

Speaker 1: Yes,

00:42:46

Speaker 1: but I think that for now the debate continues.

00:42:49

Speaker 2: Our next piece of feedback comes in response to episode 2 65 where one of our listeners wrote in about having a knee surgery wound exposed in a hot climate. They wanted to be wearing shorts and things like that and attracting conversation about it when they don't want it. So, the person was having lunch

00:43:08

Speaker 2: and then a total stranger says, oh, you just had knee surgery. I just had the same thing that then in our question,

00:43:15

Speaker 2: ask her really wanted to get out of that conversation, are not invited to begin with. And so we have the following feedback from LG

00:43:24

Speaker 1: Dear lizzie and dan have a couple of comments about the woman who took her mother to lunch as the mother was recuperating from knee replacement surgery.

00:43:32

Speaker 1: The issue was about strangers who come to share stories during the lunch the whole time I listened to this question and your answers. I kept wondering why the mother didn't simply cover her wound by wearing loose cotton or linen slacks or a long loose skirt before going in public.

00:43:47

Speaker 1: I lived in south texas, even hotter than Alabama for a decade and wore such clothing

00:43:52

Speaker 1: first as a point of etiquette. Some of the other patrons eating lunch may not appreciate a recent wound in their midst as they ate.

00:44:00

Speaker 1: More importantly though, it is medically unsafe to expose a recent wound in public, both for the patient and for the public. We know the wound was still recent because it's still bore steri strips. I double check this with my husband, a physician at Yale covering the wound would be the considerate and safe way to go out and enjoy lunch. It would also keep fellow patrons from intruding on the mother and daughter's time together sincerely, L. G.

00:44:23

Speaker 2: This is an interesting perspective. I can't remember from the question how open the wound was or if it was banned and you know, I can't remember. But the reference of steri strips suggests that it was open and that that's an interesting idea that if you just wore something long and loose,

00:44:41

Speaker 2: I don't know how comfortable the loose skirt or the loose pants might be if we're dealing with crutches, if this particular person would worry about them getting caught up or something like that if they weren't accustomed to crutches. So that might be a question or why they didn't go that route the first time around. But I like the fact that it's a suggestion that can also just help

00:45:03

Speaker 2: ward off the questions because you can't see where the wound is. You know, you might see someone using crutches or a cane or a walker but you don't see

00:45:10

Speaker 2: exactly what's going on.

00:45:12

Speaker 1: I love this feedback because it's 3 60 etiquette. It's etiquette coming from all directions. We really consider this question from the perspective of the daughter and the mother who was trying to figure how to respond.

00:45:25

Speaker 1: I really like this awareness of how

00:45:28

Speaker 1: presenting your medical issues in public is a question for the people who are confronted with it are faced with it as well.

00:45:35

Speaker 2: And I like the fact that we're bringing up the health of the wound and the relationship of the mother and daughter and their time together and

00:45:42

Speaker 2: there's, there's a whole lot going on in there. I like this 3 60 view because 3 60 etiquette

00:45:49

Speaker 1: LG thank you for the feedback.

00:45:52

Speaker 2: Thank you for sending us your thoughts and updates and please keep them coming. You can send your comment or update two awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com or leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 K. I N. D. That's 8028585463.

00:46:10

Speaker 1: It's time for our post script segment where we dive deeper into a topic of etiquette and today we're going to talk about manners abroad. We're going to take advantage of a moment of opportunity here.

00:46:20

Speaker 2: It was really fun being in all the different scenarios that I was in in Italy because it did give me a chance to kind of ask some questions

00:46:29

Speaker 2: from the perspective of what we do

00:46:31

Speaker 2: when it comes to table manners or customs. For instance, one of the first things I remembered was my mom teaching me that if I was going to go over to the homeowners portion of the house that we were in that I needed to ask permits. So I think that's how you pronounce it to ask if I was allowed to come in. That's the normal exchange given the relationship that we have to one another that you know, like best friends or you know family might not say such things but that I should and that would be the way to show show my good etiquette. So I like that too. But you know that it's okay for me to ask permission to come in as opposed to stand there and wait to be invited

00:47:09

Speaker 2: that I actually asked permission to cross the barrier. I'm liking this more

00:47:13

Speaker 1: and more the more specific you

00:47:15

Speaker 2: get

00:47:16

Speaker 2: the owners of the house. Her granddaughter is not not far off an age. So we hung out for an evening Caroline and I got to go hang out with her friends at a table and trying to explain to folks who didn't speak fluent english but spoke some english what we do at Emily Post and what our role is

00:47:35

Speaker 2: in american culture and both the family history of doing that and the idea that you would have someone who could have a job doing what we do. It was interesting trying to figure out the language to explain it when we were both limit. I was very limited in my italian they had much her friends had much better english. So

00:47:56

Speaker 2: but it was still an interesting idea because a lot of the things we teach, you know they were saying well your mom teaches you that and I said, yeah I know our moms teaches it to, it's just it's funny how you need reminders or when it comes to work. Sometimes your work wants you to learn certain aspects of it

00:48:11

Speaker 2: and getting at the uh one of the differences when we would talk about sincerity and a lot of times were teaching sincerity and how to let your sense yourself through. Like the example I would give is, you know, it's like the difference between someone saying me dispatch, which is, I'm sorry

00:48:30

Speaker 2: and someone saying, oh me dispatch, you know, I'm really sorry and that was one of the few examples I was able to give. That gave the tonal difference of some of the subtle things we try to teach. So it was really interesting just trying to explain and work through the language barrier. But also just the

00:48:47

Speaker 2: the kind of cultural difference because we don't teach straight protocol either,

00:48:51

Speaker 2: which is really different because there might be a certain aspect of life in which you use, you know, I think military protocol where there is a lot of specifics to it and we don't quite teach that, but there's a protocol for the table and there were things I wanted to know like do we all just grab and eat off pieces and

00:49:10

Speaker 2: and tear pieces of bread and tear pieces of meat and cheese and leave the other half for someone or

00:49:15

Speaker 2: do you need to use your fork and knife or just a fork? That's for the serving platter. You know in America you have a lot of people really concerned about germs and among friends over there, that was not something I saw it was sharing from plates and it was tearing food with hands and

00:49:31

Speaker 2: eating with hands and forks and knives no matter the type of food sometimes. And

00:49:36

Speaker 2: it was really, I mean not totally there. You know if you had like beef stew, you were eating it with a fork and knife. But it was really interesting to kind of have what felt to me as wonderfully relaxed table manners. Even people talking with their mouth somewhat full. There was an elegance to that that was really interesting and comfortable and easy among friends.

00:49:59

Speaker 1: You're painting such a vivid picture. There are so many questions I could

00:50:02

Speaker 2: ask directions

00:50:03

Speaker 1: that I'd love to take the conversation first one.

00:50:06

Speaker 1: I'm curious

00:50:07

Speaker 1: you're describing having dinner with the granddaughter and some friends. Do you feel like the table manners, expectations would be more formal if you were at grandma's house

00:50:18

Speaker 2: both. Yes and no. There was a certain level of, I just wanted to be what I knew of my proper self at the table when we were at grandmother's house

00:50:28

Speaker 2: nana Adriana and that you know, was using serving platters. But I also saw people you know eating, you know, just tearing a hunk of bread and eating it. You know, not like being formal about how they buttered it or

00:50:44

Speaker 2: passing things to people easily that was fine. So yeah, it didn't feel formal when I was at grandma's,

00:50:51

Speaker 2: but I think I was more casual with the friends who were being casual with each other, but I don't want to make it sound like the family wasn't casual with each other because it felt very casual.

00:51:00

Speaker 2: Like we, you know, Tigre, the cat would pop in our laps and the hosts would say like, oh my goodness, but everyone would want to turn holding Tigre at the table, you know what I mean? And just the finger little bits of food and so things like that, I think made it feel very relaxed and homey and comfortable and

00:51:19

Speaker 2: like you just

00:51:21

Speaker 2: grab your bread and put your meat and cheese on it and take a bite. Then, you know,

00:51:27

Speaker 1: I love it someday. I want to let your parents take me around you

00:51:31

Speaker 2: should you and food would have a great time.

00:51:33

Speaker 1: Can I ask a question in a slightly different arena? Yes, please. You told me a story that I'm hoping I can get you to tell on air.

00:51:40

Speaker 1: Oh gosh about getting onto a train.

00:51:44

Speaker 2: Oh, this, oh yeah, no, I'm happy to tell this story. This is a great moment of of like,

00:51:50

Speaker 2: it's so funny how someone can appear rude and then turn around and be polite and you don't know because there's a language barrier there, whether they

00:51:59

Speaker 2: realized by how you reacted to them that they were being rude or whether they didn't notice at all and we're just then had a moment of rudeness and then a moment of politeness, but Caroline and I were running to go get onto the train and people were starting to feel a little rushed to make it. And a gentleman really

00:52:18

Speaker 2: pushed past me to meet his partner and get onto the train

00:52:22

Speaker 2: and you know, we were at the, you know, traveling ropes were starting to fray and, and we both Caroline and I kind of looked at each other and we're like, well I guess he needed to be up there or you know, like no courtesy.

00:52:37

Speaker 2: And as soon as he was up onto the train himself with all his luggage up, he turned around and actually grabbed our bags and started hauling them up to get us up and on faster. And I just looked at him and I said, oh my gosh, I said, thank you so much. Like he really made me smile. That was, I didn't, you know, he didn't speak english and I didn't speak whichever language he spoke and but I just wanted him to know like, wow, thank you like that you clearly saw I wasn't happy or you just simply are a really wonderful person. I don't know which of the two happened, but

00:53:10

Speaker 2: you did something really thoughtful in a moment. That was a hectic moment and that was really, it was nice to

00:53:17

Speaker 2: immediately turn that switch and just

00:53:20

Speaker 2: all you could do because it's not like you could explain, oh man, I'm sorry, I'm so used to people being jerks like, you know, it wasn't like I could explain any of that, I had to just put on a really big smile and show my gratitude as much with my body language and face as I could, you know,

00:53:37

Speaker 1: I love that story cause I can picture the whole thing, I can

00:53:40

Speaker 1: confess, I've probably felt that lizzie post, look at some point in my life that, oh, can you believe that just happened

00:53:46

Speaker 2: or that you did that to me

00:53:48

Speaker 1: or but I also love the response not being defensive or standoffish, but uh oh

00:53:55

Speaker 1: because we all have those

00:53:57

Speaker 2: moments too, I don't know if he even noticed, but

00:54:00

Speaker 1: maybe it wasn't, maybe, maybe it was just now I'm on it and now that I've got a moment to breathe, I can look around

00:54:06

Speaker 1: the idea that so much rudeness that we experience isn't intentional and that there can be such a little thing, such a little line to cross where that self awareness enters the equation and then even a positive assistance of those around us starts to just transform other people's experiences. It's, it's all right there it goes from

00:54:26

Speaker 1: sort of the needle and the bad side of the meter to the needle on the good side of the mirror and I can sort of see the ticks in between as it finds its way over.

00:54:35

Speaker 2: I think one of the things I've tried to learn that makes my travel a lot better is as soon as you get a good tick run with it, that as soon as that person turns around and smiles or offers you that assistance or

00:54:47

Speaker 2: pushes past you to get into line and then offers you the space ahead of them or, you know, picks up that thing that fell for you just or sees that you need help with your luggage or that nobody

00:55:00

Speaker 2: in the past 100 passengers getting off the plane has offered to let you get out of your eyes seat and like get a chance to get off the plane just for example. Yeah. You know that didn't happen or anything, but it really it's it's take the little moment, that is the good moment and try to really embrace that and move with that and let it shine as the good moment, and it means a little bit more um wonderful term that I have now adopted in my life, a little bit more Poggi bones, e a little bit more up and down,

00:55:29

Speaker 2: like a little more quickly,

00:55:30

Speaker 2: but you it really does for me, get me out of the funk of we're being herded like cattle and everybody is awful and the kid's gonna scream and and that this is going to have to wait

00:55:47

Speaker 1: another 30 minutes.

00:55:48

Speaker 2: It's like,

00:55:50

Speaker 2: oh my gosh, you help me with my bags, Thanks, that's awesome, thank you, thank you, thank you.

00:55:54

Speaker 2: And it makes I think finding those little bright spots make you less likely to get over reactive to the negative ones, they do build up.

00:56:03

Speaker 2: I've never been on a single trip where someone hasn't sniped at someone else, someone hasn't

00:56:08

Speaker 2: gotten lost and been frustrated about it or just, I've never been on a trip where it's just been 100% you know, golden sunshine, rainbows, unicorns, but I have really embraced the idea of as quickly as you can to embrace the little things that get your spirits back up

00:56:30

Speaker 2: the better off you'll be

00:56:31

Speaker 1: well, good work out there in the broader world and thanks for bringing a little bit of that home as well.

00:56:36

Speaker 2: Wait, can we keep talking about the food way

00:56:42

Speaker 1: we can. Next show,

00:56:44

Speaker 2: I'd love that.

00:56:45

Speaker 1: Today I close

00:56:49

Speaker 1: uh oh

00:57:00

Speaker 1: based on,

00:57:03

Speaker 1: well we have come to the end and we like to end our show on a high note. So we turn to you to hear about the good etiquette you're seeing and experiencing out in the world and that can come in so many forms. Today we hear from Sandra, Good morning lizzie and dan, I just finished listening to the newest podcast and thought I would send along a salute to several people at Thunder Bay Airport.

00:57:24

Speaker 1: We have a cabin in northern Minnesota. So Thunder Bay is the closest airport to us. My son had flown into Minneapolis ST paul airport from new york city and was returning home after some wonderful cabin time

00:57:36

Speaker 1: when I took him to the Thunder Bay Airport which was my first time doing so, several things went wrong

00:57:42

Speaker 1: when I went to pay my parking ticket. It wouldn't take my discover card or american money. I ran up to the little restaurant to see if I could buy something and get Canadian change but sadly I couldn't. The nice lady working called over to the parking attendant to help me. He was standing 10 ft or so away when another lady close to me reached out and tapped me on the shoulder,

00:58:01

Speaker 1: she offered me $3.25 in Canadian coins and would not accept my feeble american money to pay her back.

00:58:09

Speaker 1: I thanked her profusely. I paid for my parking ticket but didn't understand I needed a different ticket to exit the parking lot.

00:58:17

Speaker 1: Then my receipt. So back to the bargaining pay station I went the kind parking attendant came on when I pushed help and sent someone to make sure that I had all the right things to exit the parking lot.

00:58:27

Speaker 1: And when I went to exit he was standing there waiting to make sure I got out,

00:58:32

Speaker 1: he waved me on with a huge smile. My son called after hearing my message from the beginning of my troubles and I said don't worry, Canada took very good care of me,

00:58:42

Speaker 1: thank you kind strangers and thank you lizzie and dan for helping me give them a shout out

00:58:47

Speaker 1: Sandra.

00:58:48

Speaker 2: Sandra. Oh my goodness, That does sound like one of those travel moments where it's like everything you try to do right somehow doesn't work.

00:58:57

Speaker 2: Um but I'm so glad that Canada took such good care of you and that you got out with a big smile on your face.

00:59:09

Speaker 1: Thank you for listening and thank you to everyone who sent us something. Please connect with the show and share it with friends, family and coworkers or on social media. You can send us your next question comment or salute to awesome etiquette at Emily Post dot com. You can leave us a message or text at 80285 A kind that's 8028585463

00:59:30

Speaker 1: on twitter. We are at Emily Post ins

00:59:32

Speaker 2: and at lizzie a post That's lizzie with an E

00:59:35

Speaker 1: on facebook where awesome etiquette and the Emily Post Institute. And on instagram we are at Emily Post Institute. Please consider becoming a sustaining member. You can find out more about this by visiting awesome etiquette dot Emily Post dot com. You can also subscribe to the ads version of our show on Itunes or your favorite podcast app

00:59:53

Speaker 1: and please consider leaving us a review. It's another way to support the show. It helps our show ranking and helps more people find awesome etiquette. Our show is edited by Chris Albertine. Thanks Chris, thanks chris.

01:00:08

Speaker 1: Mhm