Episode 291 - R-E-S-P-E-C-T
In this episode of Awesome Etiquette
Welcome to Awesome Etiquette, where we explore modern etiquette through the lens of consideration, respect and honesty. On today’s show Dan and Lizzie take your questions on having a name that is regularly pronounced and spelled incorrectly, the 15-item limit in the express checkout lane, intrusive breastfeeding questions and children at church. For Awesome Etiquette sustaining members our question is about planning a big wedding ceremony, when you’re technically already married. Plus your most excellent feedback, etiquette salute and a postscript on number two in our top most viewed content.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's just that you don't know how to use social goodness. See, it's old fashioned
Speaker 2: watch how busy post and then post to act as host and hostess. They know that courtesy means showing respect, thinking of the other person, real friendliness.
Speaker 2: Hello and welcome to awesome etiquette, where
Speaker 1: we explore modern etiquette through the lens of consideration, respect and honesty.
Speaker 2: On today's show, we take your questions on having a name that is regularly pronounced and spelled incorrectly, the 15 item limit in the express checkout lane.
Speaker 2: Intrusive breastfeeding questions and Children at church
Speaker 1: for awesome etiquette sustaining members. Our question is about planning a big wedding ceremony when you're technically already married,
Speaker 2: plus your most excellent feedback etiquette salute and a postscript on number two in our top most viewed pages on Emily Post com. All
Speaker 1: that's coming up
Speaker 1: Awesome etiquette comes to you from the studios of our home offices in Vermont and is proud to be produced by the Emily Post Institute. I'm Lizzie Post,
Speaker 2: and I'm Dan Post sending.
Speaker 1: How's it going, guys? Pretty good. It's good to see you.
Speaker 1: I was gonna say It's good to see you. We do do a lot of phone calls as opposed to a lot of video calls between each other. So it's it's really nice to actually see you when we do our podcast and we're
Speaker 2: zooming.
Speaker 2: So I surprised you earlier this week
Speaker 1: on our video call. I have. I have proof of the one of those things is not like the other. I
Speaker 2: liked your call out mid meeting for my bad etiquette.
Speaker 1: So Dan showed up overdressed to our meeting with potential Web developers, and
Speaker 1: he was the one guy in a tie and a button down shirt. It looked real snazzy and we had a T shirt. I was in a hoodie and the other guy was in kind of like I would say it was a casual zip up of some kind. And here's Dan looking polished. And the thing is, I did it
Speaker 2: all for you. I I had gotten ready to record the podcast that morning, and
Speaker 2: it was really an issue. She had picked out this pink tie, and she never picked out ties. That's not a part of my closet that's been of interest to her before. But a few days ago morning, she said. Oh, that one that I want that one got it out. Put it on the bed. And I said, This is this is the universe speaking to me in some way. I'm gonna I'm gonna wear a tie. I'm gonna surprise Lizzy and Chris. And then,
Speaker 2: of course, we
Speaker 2: delayed and rescheduled. But we had another meeting in the afternoon. I just went for it.
Speaker 1: And I'm liking the look. I got to say
Speaker 2: I do the cardigan over a button down with a tie, which is like a kind of addressed down tie. It's something I wouldn't haven't done in the office so much, But
Speaker 1: I kind of like it.
Speaker 1: Just so you know, all its Saturday morning We're recording this and Dan is in the same this giant and everything, and I am once again in my hoodie.
Speaker 2: But now I'm kind of superstitious about it because that day
Speaker 2: it was a really good day. Work wise, I just felt really productive. I got a ton of stuff done and it also felt like the universe matched me. It was like everything I did that day. I got really good replies.
Speaker 2: Clients I hadn't talked to in a long time. we're reaching out. It was a very good business day and I said, You know, somebody's meeting me halfway here. I'm gonna keep this up. So I did it the next day and now the next day, and it feels good.
Speaker 1: You just you keep wearing that tie because you keep wearing that tie. It's
Speaker 2: like my armor. It's like I am at work. I am a professional and
Speaker 2: I'm ready for this.
Speaker 2: Okay, So enough about ties. How are things in Burlington?
Speaker 1: Uh, they're they're good. Burlington, unfortunately, had to even more restrict social distancing. The one article I read that talked about it said a lot of young people will leave it at that who were out and and really not
Speaker 1: kind of standing 6 ft apart, not moving 6 ft away from people in the areas They encountered them. And so
Speaker 1: the city shut down. I think places like dog parks and sort of like more outdoor gathering spaces because it just wasn't it wasn't working. And so that was That was one of those Oh, man, like I wish if people had just been able to find the way to utilize those spaces better, I think we would have
Speaker 1: gotten to be in them a little bit
Speaker 2: longer,
Speaker 1: so that was kind of like the bummer news in town. But for the most part, you know, it's it's really nice. I see my neighbors walking by, um, Sonny and I play. I'm really fortunate to have a backyard. And so he and I play in the backyard and
Speaker 1: my little pot. I have my parents and my sister and her newborn niece and my newborn niece and my nephew and my brother in law, so it's really nice. Um, but it, uh, it's def. It's definitely different. Um, I feel sometimes I feel like, especially when I talk with folks who are
Speaker 1: in houses with lots of people and and feeling that I feel like the fortunate side of singledom because I'm handling the aloneness. Well, you know what I mean? Like
Speaker 1: so that that I feel like fortunate in kind of how much I get to choose about my time. So that's something I'm grateful for and reflecting on right now
Speaker 1: while also trying not to make it sound like it's bad for other people who aren't in that position. You know, it's like finding that balance in your head of, like, sympathy and gratitude. We
Speaker 2: are all finding new balances. It's true. And there's a housekeeping new balance I wanted to bring up during our intro, which is I've spent the last two weeks telling Anisha, Oh, no, no, I've got to go work. I'm going to go down to what is now are sort of home office space and
Speaker 2: it's it's something that we worked really hard to carve out a difference between. Okay, now we're hanging as a family or someone has to go to work. And it occurred to me yesterday that I needed to invite in Asia down to see what work is exactly. So we talked about ahead of time like a five or 10 minute visit where an issue is going to come and see what
Speaker 2: data even means when he says he's going down to work. I think it's gonna be much less exciting than she's picturing, but yeah,
Speaker 1: no, totally. She'll be like, Oh, that's boring. Poor data. I'm going to go play with my tea set.
Speaker 2: I mentioned it this morning. She went running over to her mother was like, Mama, Mama, Guess what? Guess what Data said.
Speaker 2: I'm going to go to work with him. I'm going to go to work. I'm gonna go down and see. And I was like, That was exactly what I was sort of hoping. And I realized I'm gonna miss the mark as a parent and not
Speaker 2: making that invitation and including her in an explicit and controlled way.
Speaker 2: So I'm hoping you'll beg me an indulgence. At some point during today's show, I might bring her down. I think it was the most exciting thing she could possibly see me do is sitting at the mic recording this
Speaker 1: show.
Speaker 1: I don't know your calls, your train, The trainer calls in the webinars and stuff like that. I mean, I know you wouldn't want a toddle are popping up in the middle of one, but I think that, like they could be interesting to give yourself some credit, you do a good job presenting, you know, you know it's
Speaker 2: true. No, but you're right. These sort of more dynamic experiences where there's someone on the screen and there's exactly well, in this particular case, a very familiar face for her. So
Speaker 1: yeah, that is really fun. And she gets kind of a feel for what this is. It will be interesting to see if, like, the whole audio version of it ready if she starts to get a better sense for what a podcast is. Because I know you guys talk about it in front of her, but I don't think a three year old has much concept of what this you know,
Speaker 1: You describe it as like it's like the song on your radio. It's like the voice of Elsa, I don't know,
Speaker 2: although she has started, she told me to turn off my podcast the other day that I listened to too many of them.
Speaker 1: That's really
Speaker 2: funny. That's really, really funny from the mouths of babes.
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: From the mouths of babes on the work front,
Speaker 2: you've actually done a few exciting things this last week, actually, genuinely exciting things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is. I've got to say we've always been grateful. Whenever media are able to bring us to their location to do an interview or shooting often, that's like morning shows down in New York City, that sort of thing,
Speaker 1: Um, but obviously that is not happening right now, and it's been really great, actually connecting with the media over
Speaker 1: this topic of social distancing and of etiquette during a completely different time for them. I mean, for all Americans. And we've had some really great interviews that have been set up as well as a number. Even we did the CBC up in Canada
Speaker 1: yesterday, and that was just even interesting. Talking about kind of the difference in
Speaker 1: politeness and the sort of recognized joke between the two countries that Canada is the polite country in America is not and, uh, joking about how that might affect people's willingness to point out inconsiderate behavior in this time or behavior that doesn't model strong social distancing practices.
Speaker 1: And so we talked about that on our website, where we have our article on social distancing etiquette
Speaker 1: and just to be prepared for getting slight reminders from people that this is such a giant habit change for so many of us that it's and the and the restrictions seem to change weekly, that I think we want to be really open and receptive to
Speaker 1: that. Uh, do you mind keeping a little bit more distance or Oh, pardon me. I'm trying to remain a full 6 ft away.
Speaker 1: Those are ways to indicate you've probably crept into a three or 4 ft territory with somebody, or they're trying to go for an item in the store and you're really standing there blocking it. So there were interesting things like that. There are numerous humorous stories about working from home
Speaker 1: and doing all of this online communication, like Zoom and Skype and FaceTime and hang out in all of these places that were
Speaker 1: meeting online and whether that's your kids and dogs and you know, the python showing up in the pictures behind you. Or its technical difficulties like the mute button working or not being used, or the question of whether or not to wear pants that has come up multiple times.
Speaker 1: Um,
Speaker 2: between
Speaker 1: Yeah, um, there's so much that people are experiencing as this is prolonged, and there's so much more we will experience from the very humorous and the very relatable to the very sad things change, and you may get news at any point of a friend or family member that is negatively impacted by this and that can just it can change your work day. It can change
Speaker 1: your family day and with limited space to process a lot of emotions. So, you know, it went from the very humorous to the very serious to the very practical in all of the conversations that we had. So we're going to be getting those interviews out via our social media. So please keep an eye out for them
Speaker 1: and definitely be writing to us. Now is a great time to be sending in your feedback about what you're experiencing, what you're seeing, what works
Speaker 1: you all as our audience know our thoughts on sample language so so strongly and well and deeply. I feel like, um, what's the sample language that's working for you in a time where, uh, it's one of our best
Speaker 2: armors that we
Speaker 1: have right now one of our best tools? Maybe that's a better word. Tools
Speaker 1: at our disposal. I keep telling people that the more you can have that friendly, calm tone that you often hear us talk about when we say using sample language in this show, the more you can have that friendly, calm tone and not have a glare, not have
Speaker 1: a grimace on your face when you address someone else about their social distancing.
Speaker 1: I think the better you're going to have a positive reaction from someone regarding it, But we want to hear from you what's working, what's not.
Speaker 2: It's a great reminder that this is likely a marathon, not a sprint. And there's going to be time to process sort of what you're talking about, the social changes that follow the immediate changes that are necessitated by the whole situation. And
Speaker 2: I would second your call that we have eyes and ears out there all throughout the awesome etiquette audience that are so valuable and so important to help us figure out how people are adapting and changing and
Speaker 2: finding what works in
Speaker 2: this tough situation.
Speaker 1: Speaking of adapting and changing, we have quite a lot of questions, Bridget said. It was it was flooded with coronavirus questions, and we wanted to to not have that be the whole theme of the show. So we tried to mix them in. So some of these questions coming up might be more reflective of different times in our life.
Speaker 1: But we are We are really excited to
Speaker 1: get to some etiquette questions.
Speaker 2: Awesome etiquette is here to answer your questions. You can email them to awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com. You can leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind That's 8028585463 You can also reach us on social media on Twitter, We are at Emily Post inst on Instagram. We are at Emily Post Institute and on Facebook. We are awesome etiquette.
Speaker 2: Just remember to use the hashtag awesome etiquette with your social posts so that we know you want your question on the show.
Speaker 2: Mhm.
Speaker 1: Our first question is titled Pronunciation Problems High Awesome Etiquette. My name is Rubella and I am a sophomore in high school.
Speaker 1: Since I've been in kindergarten, I have faced the eternal problem of having to clarify the pronunciation and spelling of my name
Speaker 1: for the longest time. It never bothered me that I had to help people say my name.
Speaker 1: Yes, I would dread roll call in every class, but I'd mainly joke around if the teacher said my name wrong.
Speaker 1: However, now that I am in high school, I am communicating with many teachers on a daily basis. I'm starting to get irritated much more quickly than I used to. If somebody spells my name wrong in an email,
Speaker 1: one of my teachers, whom I've known since the very beginning of ninth grade, still spells my name wrong in every email and obviously avoids saying my name in fear that she will say it wrong.
Speaker 1: I have reminded her of the pronunciation and spelling of my name multiple times, yet she keeps forgetting.
Speaker 1: My name says a lot about my culture and background. By brushing off name misspellings and mispronunciations, I feel like I'm leaving out a huge part of who I am.
Speaker 1: What is the best way to confront my teacher about this? Thanks in advance for your advice. Sincerely. Rubella
Speaker 2: Rubella. Thank you for your question and for your very thoughtful and well written email,
Speaker 2: you raise a question that comes up often in the world of etiquette. There is a version of this question. Whenever I'm teaching introductions, there is a long form version of the teaching module. In a short version, when I do the short version, invariably someone raises a hand and asks,
Speaker 2: What if I get someone's name wrong? What if I mispronounced someone's name? What if someone's mispronouncing my name and I'm often saying in the longer version of this presentation you're anticipating the slide that comes next in the deck because it's
Speaker 2: a question that is really important to a lot of people on both sides of the dilemma that you're describing. And
Speaker 2: I really like your framing of this, the way that you talked clearly about the significance of your name, what it means to you, how it's an important part of your identity, and to me, that is as well expressed a sentiment about the importance of names as I've heard. And it's a really good reminder how important it is to do our best to get this right.
Speaker 1: I'm noticing, too, that it's the repetition that makes it start to feel wrong. It's like the
Speaker 1: point with this particular teacher where it's further along. In the year, there have been a number of requests that the change happens. I've noticed that what's being pointed out specifically by Regula is the written email form is and I agree that
Speaker 1: to me, that feels like a more egregious repeated error on the side of etiquette
Speaker 1: than the pronunciation one, and you can hear even rubella, say it feels like she's afraid to pronounce my name. And that's that's something that I think a lot of people can understand that fear and identify with that one. But the written one is one where
Speaker 1: making sure that you get that right once someone has corrected you on it, I think is really important. And it's why I want to give rubella some language or something that helps her communicate with this teacher so that those emails feel like they are respectful. You know,
Speaker 2: I agree with you that there is
Speaker 2: less of a,
Speaker 2: uh, excuse, and I don't even like to use that word for the misspelling to getting someone's name wrong. When it's written on the
Speaker 2: previous email in the signature, it should be one of the email name itself,
Speaker 1: like address
Speaker 2: itself. That's not a question of sort of a difficult time with consonant formation or a series of sounds that just
Speaker 2: can feel unfamiliar because your mouth isn't practiced, making them that that's a mistake, that
Speaker 2: I think that it's easier to have some sympathy and understanding about that Miss Spelling error. You're right. It's an easier correction. It's easier to get it right, so it's harder to be as gracious and understanding about the repetition of that mistake.
Speaker 2: I do think that in some ways, the answer the etiquette answer is the same that you keep up your reminders. And the onus
Speaker 2: really falls on you to not get frustrated or upset with the other person that as hard as it is to maintain that high road and keep in your mind that place of understanding
Speaker 2: that this might not be intentional. In fact, it probably isn't that even if it is a simple mistake to fix, like getting a spelling correct that there could be avoidance issues that start to come up in people's minds where they're they're literally shutting down because they're scared about getting it wrong or they know they're getting it wrong. And
Speaker 2: your job is to, as helpfully and gently as possible, get them to the place of doing the right thing. That's going to feel better for them and you, and it's okay to keep reminding to get there.
Speaker 1: And there is the possibility in the case with my name, at least where there are different multiple spellings of it. Auto correct defaults to the Y spelling of Lizzie. So even people I know who know my name is spelled with an I e. Often I end up with messages from them that have Lizzie with a Y. I don't know if that's the kind of thing that could be happening if there's an easy auto correct. But for folks who do experience this a lot, and it's like, Oh, wait. But I know that person knows different.
Speaker 1: I've just I've unfortunately have succumbed to just saying Everything is an autocorrect mistake to quell my own issue. When I see that, why show up in my in box? You know what I mean? You know, that's only if that can happen. For a lot of names, that is not what's going on. It's just their negligence. Or like Dan said, it's kind of this underlying subconscious avoidance.
Speaker 2: My phone finally learned how to spell Pooja. I'm so happy did it. Yes,
Speaker 2: I also want to acknowledge that there is a power dynamic at play here in the relationship that we're talking about a teacher and student, and it's not a boss employee relationship. It's not identical to someone that you report to in a professional capacity, but it
Speaker 2: There is
Speaker 2: a worthwhile consideration here about how you make corrections for people who have some kind of authority in your life, and I also want to be realistic about.
Speaker 2: They're being a cost benefit analysis that sometimes you say to yourself, this person clearly isn't trying, and if I continue to bring it up and raise it to the point where it generates anger in them or they start to get frustrated with me, that that's not good, that doesn't speak well of them. But
Speaker 2: it might fall on you more and more to say Listen, that's them. That's their issue in their problem, and I can't correct or fix them and you have to start to work on. I've
Speaker 1: taken the avenues that I can and it still hasn't changed,
Speaker 2: and that's just a reality of the situation that I think is important to acknowledge. Even if you're doing all the right steps and the corrective steps, that
Speaker 1: or that it's an option, it's an option to say Okay, I'm doing all the right things and I'm going to I'm going to just choose to let this go until I don't have this teacher anymore. But it's
Speaker 1: also an option to, I think, address it and address it in a way that says, You know, I am sure this is unintentional or I I really like to give the benefit of the doubt that this is unintentional, but it is something that matters to me for a number of reasons, and, um, one of them being that it is my identity, my name. It is like the thing that distinguishes me from the other students around. And
Speaker 1: we work so closely together throughout the year, and I really enjoy our working relationship. I don't want you to feel like it's tough to pronounce my name. I don't I want I want to find a way to make it easy for you and I also would just so appreciate
Speaker 1: seeing it spelled correctly. It makes such a difference to me Every time I see it wrong, it catches just a little bit
Speaker 1: for me in my mind, and I would just love to not experience that weekly. If if you think that's something you can help me with, you know, I mean and that's like a very generous way to say that I think like
Speaker 2: that is a longer version of a sample script, then we usually get, but I really like it because this is it's a real problem. We're talking about
Speaker 2: something that is an impediment in a relationship, and I like your conversational tone and approach. And I like your willingness to talk about why it's significant to you how you care about the relationship, how you want to help them get it right.
Speaker 2: And all of the techniques that are on display in the question are the same techniques you use to help that person get it right. The phonetic breakdown of the spelling so that someone can see what those sounds are supposed to sound like in in a way that's familiar to them,
Speaker 2: the continued re spelling of it in a way that makes it easy for them to find it, and then a willingness to help them actually figure out what those sounds are and how to make them, and then a little patients, as they really work to get it right.
Speaker 2: A lot of what we're talking about here acknowledges the length of this relationship. This is happening over time, and it brings to mind the thought that the sooner in a relationship. You can do this the easier it often is for everyone and
Speaker 2: that there's nothing rude or inappropriate about making those corrections early on doing it in a way that gives someone again all the tools they need to get it right, and
Speaker 2: that is in service of the relationship. And it's really a help to that person. The sooner you can do it.
Speaker 1: Rubella. We hope that this helps, and we hope that the rest of the school year goes smoothly.
Speaker 2: The youngsters who start to learn their manners early are fortunate youngsters. They may not think so at the time, but as they grow older, they realize that good manners can't be put on for special occasions. Owner
Speaker 2: Our next question is titled 15 Item Fast Lane,
Speaker 2: Hi, Lizzie and Dan. I hope you guys are enjoying some time to relax during this craziness. I absolutely adore your podcast, and I've never written in with a question because I never had one that was worthy enough.
Speaker 2: But given current situations, maybe I'm not the only one with this question.
Speaker 2: If an express lane at a checkout has a 15 item limit, does that strictly mean you can have 15 items. If I'm buying six oranges, does that count as one item or as six or anything I'm buying multiples of, for that matter.
Speaker 2: Thanks so much for all your hard work. Best wishes, Laura.
Speaker 1: Oh, Laura, Have you opened a can for us? I guess I am going to pre predict that this is gonna be like
Speaker 1: pizza toppings. Level response from people,
Speaker 1: potentially
Speaker 2: Or is it simple? Is it super simple? Is there just one? I
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, Dan and I had the exact same example for this. I think that when you're buying oranges separately, that it's like four oranges for $5 that that's four items. But when you buy the bag of oranges that one bag sealed together at the one price, that's one item.
Speaker 1: So if you're really trying to get crafty, think about the items and how they're bagged when you're purchasing them. Um, but it does. It's an interesting question. How much counts? How much ends up being too much over the line? I always fear that moment where the where the clerk who's working the checkout line there sees me with my probably 20 items and says, I just come over here like I can take care of you. And then three people with two items show up behind me, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: she asked me to step in line.
Speaker 1: I swear I'm not that person.
Speaker 2: Okay? I'm giving you an etiquette pass because you've got a dispensation from a person with authority
Speaker 1: for that for that circumstance only.
Speaker 2: What about three cans of soup that are all the same kind of soup?
Speaker 1: No, that's three separate items.
Speaker 2: Obviously,
Speaker 1: Totally. It's just like the six oranges that are not bagged groups together.
Speaker 2: 15 items means 15 times. It's 15 times they scan something or set something down and weigh it and enter a produce code. Or I'm saying 15 is 15 and
Speaker 2: that should simplify
Speaker 1: things. And I think so. No, I think that that actually does it the weighing of it or the scanning of it. Because you're right. You're If you had, like, six portabello mushroom tops, you're not gonna count them as six portabello mushroom tops unless they're wrapped and packaged individually. Not a good idea. Um, it's that, you know, like the that's that's I think how you look at it is it being scanned or wade in one unit.
Speaker 2: Can I go a little bit deeper? I think the etiquette question here is one of honesty.
Speaker 2: This is one of those places in life where maybe we're challenged to hold ourselves to a standard of honesty because you look down in your basket and you start running the little tally in your head and you say, Oh, that's 17 items. That's about 15 items and it's not. It's over 15 items, and that express lane is 15 or less, just a thought.
Speaker 1: Okay, so wait a second that you just said something that made me go back to our bagged and separated oranges so you could have the type of display That's the four oranges for $5. And we were thinking that that's just like, four cans of soup for $5 or something like that and that that's four items.
Speaker 1: And then I was saying, Well, that, then you've got the bagged Citrus a lot of the time, or the bagged fruit, you know, like four kiwis in one bag or four oranges in one bag.
Speaker 1: And that I would think would count as one item because like you said. It's one scan, but then there's the third option of oranges by the pound. So what if you get oranges that are like, you know, $3 a pound or 2 99 a pound or something like that?
Speaker 1: Then I think you're in an interesting category of all those are getting weighed and and price together as one item, right?
Speaker 2: So then it's one. If they
Speaker 1: then it's one.
Speaker 2: It's one produce going
Speaker 1: one way. All those oranges are being sold.
Speaker 2: It kind of does. And you're right. I think the four for five is an example where No, you don't need to that those four oranges or five bucks, that's one that's through.
Speaker 2: Even if they were loosened my cart, I would maybe call that one item
Speaker 1: because you could put them in the compostable bag, you know, together or the paper bag together. Yes,
Speaker 2: you could, and
Speaker 1: they got away together, just like your mushrooms that are in the bag. Loosely pick. You know,
Speaker 1: this is fun. Thank you so much, Laura, for an entertaining question. Dan, do you have any last thoughts on on the grocery line etiquette?
Speaker 1: Only then I think it's
Speaker 2: simpler than I thought it was.
Speaker 1: I think so too.
Speaker 2: Take your place in line. Wait your turn. But move along as the line moves
Speaker 2: and then comes time to pay. Oh, what a line stopper this can be.
Speaker 2: That dime was in that pocket this morning. But where Oh, where can it be now?
Speaker 2: Mm.
Speaker 1: This next question is titled Bothered and not Breastfeeding.
Speaker 1: Dear Lizzie and Dan, Thank you for your wonderful podcast. I enjoy listening and love learning more about etiquette in modern life. I was wondering if I could get your advice about how to best handle the following situation.
Speaker 1: I have a wonderful six month old daughter and I was very lucky to be able to breastfeed her for the first five months. My husband and I then decided to switch her to formula to ensure a seamless transition into nursery. Once I go back to working outside of the house,
Speaker 1: I've been receiving a lot of questions and comments from female relatives from my husband's side of the family regarding our decision.
Speaker 1: Are you still breastfeeding? Why did you stop? I breast fed my Children for more than two years, et cetera.
Speaker 1: Although I'm
Speaker 2: sure they meant Well,
Speaker 1: I find these questions uncomfortable and a little intrusive. What would be a polite way to indicate that I'm not willing to discuss our decisions regarding our daughter with them? I'd love your input and help.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for considering my question. And I hope you're all staying safe and healthy. Warmest regards a desperate new
Speaker 2: mom.
Speaker 2: Oh, desperate new mom I well, first of all, just have to say virtual hugs and congratulations, six months old. That is so much fun. Um, and it's It's that age where every month there's a whole new universe, So I just so jealous and continue to enjoy it
Speaker 2: At nine months, I feel like they're already slipping away. I'm like looking back and sort of wistfully
Speaker 2: in answer to your question. To me, this is really about boundary setting, and
Speaker 2: we have different versions of that conversation. Sometimes they're professional, sometimes their personal. This one's incredibly personal. This is about your body and your parenting decisions, and it really is nobody's business. And at the same time, everybody in your life
Speaker 2: is going to feel interested to varying degrees and might not see it the same way.
Speaker 2: And they might see their interests as natural curiosity as a desire to help, as wanting to be connected, to know what's going on in your life.
Speaker 1: Almost expected, commonplace. We're both mothers. We get to talk about this like or even were women. We get to talk about this. I noticed that the question seemed to be coming from the female members of the family.
Speaker 1: It could be the men, too. But if I do find it like some people, just think if it's supposed to be a bodily function that you and your gender share somehow you you're meant to bond and talk about that, you know?
Speaker 1: So there's I like Dan, that you're really laying out the perspective of why such a personal thing
Speaker 1: can end up being something that just so many people feel willing to talk and share and ask about.
Speaker 2: And it's meant to make it easier for you to not take those questions so personally and also feel
Speaker 2: really sort of easy about disengaging from that whole conversation and putting up however strong a boundary or barrier as you want to put up. And
Speaker 2: there are people quite close to me in my life you have to manage their relationship, particularly with their parents, in really careful ways. Because the parents are used to giving their advice, they think it's important to give their advice. They think at a time in life where
Speaker 2: their kids are learning to do something that they feel they know a lot about because they did it, they want to. They want to be right there and offering their input.
Speaker 2: And if that's the kind of relationship you're talking about, managing a boundary setting conversation itself might be really important.
Speaker 2: Mom, Dad, there's something I really want to talk with you about. Do you have a minute this evening this afternoon? Now? Yeah, absolutely. What's what's on your mind?
Speaker 2: I want to talk about the way we talk about parenting, and
Speaker 2: you use the when you I feel statements so that you're taking responsibility for your feelings. But you're also letting someone know how their actions impact you. And
Speaker 2: those actions can just be the topics of discussion that they raise, how they talk about something that's all valid and and okay to bring up an address. In a conversation like that,
Speaker 2: you might be talking about a much shorter duration. The relationship itself might be
Speaker 2: one where you're not in his constant communication with someone where you talk to them less frequently, where they're touching base and asking the question. And in those instances, the boundary setting
Speaker 2: might be appropriate at a smaller dosage right in the moment.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm really not talking about breastfeeding right now. I think about it so much. I love to take these moments to talk about
Speaker 2: your favorite books or what we're going to be doing when we're able to get together again next, or something like that. That takes the conversation back into a direction where you're mapping out where you can connect and what you are happy to talk about, and you're valuing them in the relationship at the same time.
Speaker 1: Dan.
Speaker 1: Whoa. Good sample script I love the part about, Oh, I'd love to talk about anything other than breastfeeding right now. That's a great to me. That's one of my favorite pivots is when someone asks you about the exact thing you don't want to talk about. You say, Boy, I'd love to talk about anything but that right now,
Speaker 1: and I I just think that that is such a
Speaker 1: almost jovial way to, like, pivot that conversation and set that boundary. Um, I also really, really like the conversation within our example. It was the mom and dad, um, that I want to talk to you about how we as a family talk about parenting.
Speaker 1: I think that's like the big you know, overarching is a really good one.
Speaker 1: I think that another version of that, if you wanted just to make it like a little more tighter or a little more tighter, little targeted, targeted. That's what I like that very little targeted really home in on something. I think that you could use language that says,
Speaker 1: Hey, Mom and Dad, I was hoping we could talk. I've noticed that there's something I'm uncomfortable with, and
Speaker 1: I'm trying to let people know because it's a really common topic of conversation, and I'm trying to avoid it quite frankly right now, or I'm trying to not engage in it or not have people ask me questions or share about their experiences with it right now, you know, the topic is breastfeeding and
Speaker 1: we made our decision with our daughter, and I've just noticed that the family is really interested in it. And I was hoping you might be able to help us
Speaker 1: quell that conversation a little bit. And I think that those are like two avenues for kind of the big discussion. And then I love the in the moment. Just Boy, I'd like to talk about anything except for that. Tell me, how are your kids doing like then? Then they'll go off. You know they'll talk forever about their kids,
Speaker 1: but I I think this is starting to form some different places and different ways that are desperate new mom. All the title just breaks my heart when I see it could use to engage her family and spread the word without distancing people without making people feel like they did something terrible or wrong.
Speaker 2: It can feel like you're pushing people away. You're not. You're giving them the tools to have the relationship in a way that works for everybody. And there are steps that come before the big discussion or the explicit. No, I'm not going to talk about that. You can avoid a topic. You can
Speaker 2: ignore hints, or if someone makes a comment, you cannot respond to the comment. You can just sort of be neutral and let your silence be a first response
Speaker 2: based on your question. It sounds like these are much more direct types of questions or enquiries, so those weren't much more direct replies. And that's essentially the cost of asking those direct and personal questions as you have to be prepared
Speaker 2: and ready to have someone say No, I'd rather not talk about that with you or right now or at all
Speaker 2: desperate new Bob. Keep up the great work and continue to enjoy all of those parenting decisions that are coming your way.
Speaker 2: And in the evening, Mother has plenty of pep left to entertain friends,
Speaker 2: because by scheduling the work she does each day,
Speaker 2: she saves herself from doing too much.
Speaker 2: Our next question is about Children at church.
Speaker 2: Good day. You, too. I was talking to my mother the other day. She attends church in a congregation with lots of families. Think kids.
Speaker 2: She and my dad are older and much past the stage of life with little ones. They enjoy attending church every Sunday but are finding it harder and harder to be there.
Speaker 2: In this particular congregation. Parents don't seem to be aware of how much noise their little ones are making, and most often, don't take them out of the chapel to quiet, crying and yelling.
Speaker 2: This has become very distracting and definitely affects the feeling of the worship service. Is there anything to be done?
Speaker 2: Being at a church service can add a tricky component. Leaving people feeling offended or unwelcome is certainly never appropriate, especially in this environment.
Speaker 2: Any thoughts you might have on the subject would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Emily,
Speaker 1: Emily, Dan and I both laughed so hard when we read this because we were both sitting there saying, That's me
Speaker 2: and I'm telling Lizzie I am so that parent who's got the unruly kids sometimes, too. And I'm aware that No, this is the
Speaker 2: This is the This is the prayer moment. Of course, she colours happily right through the introduction, the Benedict and then all of a sudden we're doing like the common prayer, and she's got to ask her question at the loudest possible volume. And I'm just cringing and I want to run to the back, and,
Speaker 2: uh,
Speaker 2: I feel you. I appreciate you as that person on the other end that's aware of what a disruption it can be. Lizzie, Who are you in the congregation?
Speaker 1: Oh, totally. That person who doesn't have kids. I love kids, but I'm also like I'm in church. I had to behave when I was in church. My mom would never have let me shout questions out. I would be right out the back door,
Speaker 1: you know. And so there's totally that much older version of myself. Curmudgeonly going, you know, like or when I was young, I never would have been allowed to behave like that, that kind of stuff.
Speaker 1: And there is that part of me that thinking, Boy, I am here for this good feeling. I'm looking for this moment of quiet and concentration, but also this moment of community. So as the person sitting there, I'm often
Speaker 1: both my sympathetic brain is turned on, but my crew mention brain is also my my part, where I am irritated because it is noise and it is distraction during a time where you're trying to connect.
Speaker 1: I think that that's one of those battles that I hear raging in my head. That is the distraction people feel because it's it's not that they think often that the parent is terrible or that the child is, is somehow unruly, like pretty much all adults. No kids just have moments, and
Speaker 1: they do them in the most inopportune times often. And so there's so much forgiveness in the brain that's going on. But at the same time, it's a distraction from the thing you're trying to pay attention to, and that creates the distance, the frustration, the
Speaker 1: you know, and you're just like, Oh, man, I wish that wasn't going on right now. I wish it was the moment where all the kids are being cute and sweet and participating in lovely, adorable ways. But that just doesn't happen. They're not on cute. You can't do that.
Speaker 2: This is so to my mind, a version of the host guest dance
Speaker 2: that on one side of the equation, you've got this this awareness of like you say, the community element that you talk about That's an important part of a lot of religious communities where you want people to be welcome. You want them to participate. You want everyone to feel like there's a place for them there so that everyone has access to that experience.
Speaker 2: On the flip side, you've got the maintenance of that experience and the integrity of what that experience is, and that requires something of
Speaker 2: all of the people that are attending that our guests. And
Speaker 2: for me, the good parent etiquette is about knowing what a reasonable expectations for Children. And it's not age specific, its developmental stage specific. It's having an awareness of how long it's reasonable to expect your child to stay quiet, whether if they do meltdown or have a tantrum. You have tactics or strategies for
Speaker 2: getting it under control or
Speaker 2: removing yourself and them from the situation where that's wildly distracting.
Speaker 2: So
Speaker 2: there is a lot required of the parent bringing the child into that situation, taking some responsibility for their impact. And I think what's oftentimes the nugget or the kernel of that,
Speaker 2: that that that aggravation isn't necessarily that Children are present, but that the people responsible for them aren't
Speaker 2: being reasonable in their expectations and the way they're setting up those kids to participate in a successful way,
Speaker 1: and that word reasonable is the one that is both subjective, unfortunately, But it's also, I think, really important. I don't think I ever fault apparent. When I hear those first couple of cries go up or anything like that, it's never like the instant reaction
Speaker 1: from me in my head isn't like,
Speaker 2: you know,
Speaker 1: like that awful groaning moment. It's just like, oh, child crying. It's when it started to go on to the point where it's distracting from the service. That's when you start to hit that turning of
Speaker 1: Wait a minute. Are we in reasonable territory or not? And you're dealing with questioning someone else's
Speaker 1: determination of reasonable. You know what I mean? Because you have so little agency to say anything in the middle of a service of anything, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: And I think that right there starts to be the etiquette point where our advice for the person asking this question starts to emerge because we've talked about the parent, the reasonable expectations, the responsibility there.
Speaker 2: What do you do if you're on the other side of that equation? If with an awareness of the balance between community and experience, you feel the balance is tipping or starting to pull too strongly on one side of the scale,
Speaker 2: there's not much you can do in the moment. But you are a member of this community, this congregation, this this group and it's up to you to talk to the past or talk to the people who have authority. The deacon who you know
Speaker 2: and start to have a conversation about what kind of child care options are available to people, whether they need to be expanded, what the role of the church school is in getting roles for Children to participate, if they want to,
Speaker 2: and whether or not broadly, there are other people in the congregation who feel the same way or whether it's really that. No, this is the way this community is developing, growing and including people, and it's going to be up to you to figure out how you want to engage and participate with it.
Speaker 1: You hear us talk about moments where you want to go to the people who are in charge. You want to go to management of the facility rather than address someone directly. And this is one of those moments where we we really encourage that even to the point where you don't disrupt the service to go do that,
Speaker 1: that it's not like in the middle of the movie theater where you go and get the usher.
Speaker 1: That's not what's happening here and throwing dirty looks,
Speaker 1: throwing glances or repeated like like Oh, I'm looking over 345 times. Can you see me looking over? You should probably leave by now trying to do that kind of silent language version of your ticking people off. You're not getting the message. Go away.
Speaker 1: That is just church and and religious services. I think where people come to be fulfilled, they come to find community. It is so different from that movie theater experience where you've paid for a limited amount of time to enjoy something, and I just think it's really, really important that we recognize the difference between that. So me, even when my brain starts to get really annoyed, I'm not gonna be throwing glares anywhere. I'm not no, no side I coming for me.
Speaker 1: Um, the appropriate way to deal with that is focused as best as you can on the ceremony ahead of you on the service ahead of you on the speaker ahead of you.
Speaker 1: And then afterwards, as Dan said, engage in in asking the pastor asking whoever it is that's in charge of this. What can be done or just simply that you want to. You want to raise your own voice and say This is becoming a distraction for me. If there are reminders, if there are ways, I would appreciate us enacting them,
Speaker 1: Um, sometimes all it takes is raising your voice. Sometimes you're number one who's raised your voice. Sometimes you're number 150. You just don't know. But that's the way to do it. It's not. It's not with the glances and glares. It's not with the nudges. And could you please maybe take your baby outside whispers?
Speaker 2: Because I really like that.
Speaker 2: Their explicit reminder about the difference in approach between the religious service and something like a movie or concert. That, and I realized as you were talking that a version of what I was saying could be understood in the moment. Go find a deacon or someone to go talk to the person I was like No, no, no, that's not what I meant. I'm sitting there waving at you through the zoom,
Speaker 2: and I couldn't agree more in those moments. You want to be your most generous sort of humble understanding, self and and there are other, more appropriate times to address it.
Speaker 1: Emily. We certainly sympathize from all perspectives. And we hope that once we are able to return to gathering that you really enjoy your services and that until then, if you're joining any zoom or video church services in the meantime
Speaker 1: that they are equally spaces where you really get to reflect and feel fulfilled.
Speaker 1: Take care. When we watch movies,
Speaker 2: we are
Speaker 1: careful not to make too much noise.
Speaker 1: That way we can hear and learn more.
Speaker 1: And you know, we have found that knowing when to be quiet is a part of growing up.
Speaker 2: Thank you for your questions. Please send us updates or feedback on our answers to awesome etiquette. At Emily post dot com. You can leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind. That's 8028585463 You can also reach us on social media on Twitter. We are at Emily Post instead
Speaker 2: on Instagram. We are at Emily Post Institute and on Facebook. We are awesome etiquette.
Speaker 2: Just remember to use the hashtag awesome etiquette with your social posts so that we know you want your question comment or feedback on the show.
Speaker 1: If you love awesome etiquette, consider becoming a sustaining member by visiting us at patreon dot com slash awesome etiquette.
Speaker 1: You'll get an ADS free version of the show and access to bonus questions and content. Plus, you'll feel great knowing that you helped keep awesome etiquette on the air.
Speaker 2: It's time for our feedback segment where we hear from you about the questions we answer in the topics we cover. We first hear from Nat on episode number 2 89 about fear of handshakes.
Speaker 2: Hi, Lizzie and Dan.
Speaker 1: I loved your
Speaker 2: alternatives to handshakes. I think I'll be using the hand over heart one a lot.
Speaker 2: A Muslim man did so when being introduced to me once, and I thought it was such a warm and elegant acknowledgement
Speaker 2: for family and friends that I would usually give a big hug. I've been doing jazz hands. Thanks so much, Matt.
Speaker 1: I like the jazz hands. Just
Speaker 2: I'm so excited. I'm pretty much shaking here. It's like a double wave. Hello. I
Speaker 1: didn't think of that one before. Jazz hands is great. I'm gonna start recommending that
Speaker 2: Well, it's a very different field in the hand on the heart and the nod, which has this sort of like intimate and almost sort of this sort of almost a reverence or tenderness
Speaker 1: to it exactly.
Speaker 2: Whereas the jazz hands is like
Speaker 2: I can barely contain myself. I'm shaking here, and it
Speaker 1: reminds me of little kids when they do or long or dogs when they get the zoo means while
Speaker 2: we're talking about alternatives, the one that we started doing is it's and I've heard other people doing. It's like a corona hug. You stand about 6 ft back and, like,
Speaker 2: sort of wrap your arms as if you were like wrapping your arms. Totally great big person like Totally, totally, totally
Speaker 1: New times. New greetings.
Speaker 1: Our next piece of feedback is from Lori on Episode 2 85. Talking
Speaker 2: Toys.
Speaker 1: Hi, guys. I really love your podcast and love to listen while walking on the beach during my free time. I'm a preschool teacher in New Jersey. I teach four and five year olds. Our school has a philosophy that mirrors that of your listener. We have no electronics, and our teaching is child directed
Speaker 1: That being said when my own Children were young, the birthday child's parents would gently suggest to a close friend that everyone contribute money towards a group gift. We got things like a large wooden outdoor playhouse and a trampoline instead of 20 small gifts.
Speaker 1: We've also suggested that in addition, the Children can bring a small gift to donate to a charity or a card.
Speaker 1: I hope the suggestion helps best. Laurie.
Speaker 2: Thanks, Laurie. I'm always curious to hear about how people are handling this one. We've heard about the idea of a charity gift in the past, and as long as you know that the kids are on board with that, that it's not sort of denying them an experience that they're really craving and that they're able to appreciate it in the spirit that it's organized in it. It's such a lovely idea.
Speaker 1: Thank you for sending us your thoughts and updates, and please keep them coming. You can send your feedback or update two awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com, or leave us a voicemail or text message at 802858 k i n d. That's 8028585463
Speaker 1: It's time for our post script segment, where we dive deeper into a topic of etiquette, and today we're going to resume our series on our Top 10 most search content on Emily post dot com with number two, which might seem a little strange, but it is our homepage, kind of. It's kind of a cheat.
Speaker 1: Dan explain what's going on with this list. We've been avoiding
Speaker 2: this. The reality is that when we look at our site data, our site analytics that without fail, no matter what window of time you choose, somewhere in the top 10, a top 10 result is our homepage. Just because that's where people land, that's where they go first. When they
Speaker 2: look up Emily Post online and they find Emily post dot com.
Speaker 2: It's It makes a lot of sense, and at the same time we we have been avoiding it because it's not a content page. It doesn't fit easily into the theme of our Top 10 countdown, but we got down to two and we said We really can't go pull something from not our top 10 and
Speaker 1: call it
Speaker 2: the tenant of honesty demands that we acknowledge the fact that our homepage is a place that a lot of people spend their time when they visit. Emily post dot com And it got me to sort of think about what our homepage says and what it what It communicates both about Emily Post Institute and also about etiquette. So
Speaker 2: I thought we'd talk a little bit about our homepage. Lizzie, what do you think
Speaker 1: our homepage is? A. Really? It's an interesting space, and we are actually in the process of starting to develop a new Emily Post website, one that we are really excited to have, um, hopefully underway within within the next six months. I don't know whether to like drum roll this
Speaker 2: or whether to tell you be quiet. I'm both so excited and so terrified at the prospect of a complete website overhaul that
Speaker 1: it's gonna be great. It's going to be really great. It's gonna be a lot more user friendly. There's part of me when when you say, What do you think of that homepage? I think
Speaker 1: I think I hope people understand that there's good advice there in that search bar. Um, but when I think of our homepage. I think there's a lot of times where people come to us searching for advice and they surprise Find out that we actually offer seminars and e learning, and our advice comes in the form of training.
Speaker 1: I think that that's people aren't always expecting it to be such a businesses site. In some ways, I think even though there's a lot of content front and center
Speaker 1: there is.
Speaker 2: And it's always been one of the biggest challenges of our website and our homepage that we have two different audiences. We have an audience of people that are hungry for content. They want all of that information that you think of as Emily Post information from 100 years of writing books, the reference book about etiquette.
Speaker 2: But then there's also
Speaker 2: a whole group of people that are looking for our services and how we sort of let people know that we have both of those things for them, and that this category will take care of you for these needs. In this category will take care of you for those needs is one of the great challenges of our site.
Speaker 1: That, and figuring out what content is actually going to live on our site. What content will end up creating those top 10 searched topics that we've been going through for the past 10 weeks? It's really interesting thinking about what to display, how to display at all of those kinds of things. But
Speaker 1: one of the things that I did in November of 2016 was we put in our scrolling slider consideration, respect and honesty as a real presence on that homepage. It's in big, bold letters,
Speaker 1: and I know that for those that don't understand yet that our business is built on those three
Speaker 1: principles, Um, it might seem a little bit strange or different, but for you, our audience who have been with us and who have really learned the CRH language with us, it's really our call out to say that this is the core of us. This is what we build all of this off of, and we always want that front and center
Speaker 1: when when you come and find us in this visual space,
Speaker 2: well, and as you point out there is a real challenge in terms of how you present the breath of what people think of as etiquette coherently. When you're talking about everything from births to weddings to first jobs to
Speaker 2: funeral, I mean, we're talking about the whole arc of a life is addressed in good general etiquette content, and
Speaker 2: it is always a question of what of that You highlight. How do you indicate that you have that breath of information without diluting the message that you're that you're giving people
Speaker 2: and one of the things that we do very naturally, I think both on this show and that the institute is we think about the principles that are behind all of that sort of volume of content that it can all be distilled down to a couple core principles and ideas. And
Speaker 2: it was that clarity of vision that Emily had almost 100 years ago that I think made her advice so significant, so meaningful and so lasting. And it's one of the things that I feel like we've inherited from her that has served us so well that
Speaker 2: something like the novel Coronavirus can emerge. And we've got a framework for thinking about how people interact and what's important in those interactions. How to base decisions about new situations on core principles of consideration, respect and honesty. And it's it's such a powerful framework, such a powerful construct for us. I think I start to take it for granted almost sometimes. And
Speaker 2: when I went and looked at that home page, I said, Boy, if I've never If I If I had a book of Emily Post on my shelf and this was the first thing I saw from the Emily Post Institute today
Speaker 2: that consideration, respect and honesty, I think would stand out for me, it would make sense. It wouldn't necessarily be what I would expect to find, but I think I would be delighted to find it. Those
Speaker 1: words, Yeah, definitely an encouraging three words I have to also
Speaker 2: mentioned, I think for some people, the
Speaker 2: prominence of this podcast on our home page would be a surprise. Not for anyone listening right now, but for someone that knows us in a very different way, I think, Oh, there's a podcast that
Speaker 2: it's called awesome etiquette. That's a little cheesy, but I could check that
Speaker 1: out.
Speaker 1: You know, I questioned greatly how we were going to handle the issue of the homepage as the topic of a postscript segment, and I hope you listeners can bear, bear with and pardon our navel gazing. But
Speaker 1: for us, it is a It's an active part, looking at how we present ourselves, uh, to you and to the world and how we make ourselves searchable, how we make the content that you want delivery able to you and in the ways that are going to be useful to you.
Speaker 1: And so the homepage actually is kind of a. It's a decent thought that we have on a regular basis when it comes to running the Emily Post Institute and how we're engaging with everyone. So
Speaker 1: we went there
Speaker 2: as Lizzie mentioned at the beginning. We are doing a website redesign, and it is always a little bit of a risk when we asked this question. But I would really be curious what
Speaker 2: you all would like to see from the next generation of Emily Post online. We imagine ourselves being more and more of a digital content and online content company,
Speaker 2: and we want to be serving that that
Speaker 2: need as well as we can for the next 10, 20 maybe hopefully 100 years, and
Speaker 2: every time we evolve our website. It gives us a chance to do that a little bit better. So if there are things in particular that you would love to see from US features or points of emphasis, we'd love to hear about it.
Speaker 1: For example, our business Etiquette Train, the trainer program moving to an online format was from not only us seeing that be a trend in the market, but from people saying, Boy, it would be so great if or hey, I took a class that sounds like this and it was successful. So we definitely want to hear from you.
Speaker 2: And you can stay tuned for next week, which will be the final episode of our Top 10 Countdown, where we're going to talk about the most searched piece of content on Emily post dot com. And it is not a navigation page like our homepage. So stay tuned, and we'll see on next week's postscript for the conclusion of this series.
Speaker 2: Good manners, social graces, etiquette Call it what you will
Speaker 2: All are based on consideration for others being kind of the other fellow in the little things of life, as well as the big things
Speaker 1: we like to end our show on a high note. So we turn to you to hear about the good etiquette you're seeing and experiencing out in the world, and that can come in so many forms. And today we hear from a listener in Idaho,
Speaker 2: Hi, Lizzie and Dan. I have a salute to throw out to everyone who has a little free library in their front yards Right now.
Speaker 2: I helped care for my best friend's extremely extroverted adult autistic son, and he is finding our current social restrictions very difficult to deal with. The look of defeated resignation on his face when I explained to him he wasn't allowed to visit his coffee shops and grocery stores that are full of friends for him was heartbreaking.
Speaker 2: One thing he does about once a week is check out a giant stack of books from the library, and this, too, has been taken away from him.
Speaker 2: He and I share some taste in books, but not a lot, so I can loan him a few, but not many. Then today, on a walk, I noticed a little free library in one of my neighbors yards and was able to pick up a couple of books to give my hurting friend to keep him occupied.
Speaker 2: I've always appreciated the community building spirit of folks who put out books like this, but right now they're kindnesses lifesaving.
Speaker 2: Thank you to everyone who does things like this.
Speaker 2: Your Internet friend isolating in Idaho.
Speaker 1: Oh, isolating in Idaho. This is such a great story, and I know that they've even put up recommendations for how to interact with, um, with those little free libraries which are so cute. There's a couple of them not in my actual neighborhood but a neighborhood just down the street in Burlington. And I know that that there are some good tips, but
Speaker 1: that's awesome. That's a really that's a heartwarming one.
Speaker 2: Thank you for sharing it with us and thank you to everyone who is out there doing those little things that make other people's lives just a little bit better right now. It is so appreciated.
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening.
Speaker 2: Thank you to everyone who sent us something
Speaker 1: and thank you to everyone who supports us on patreon. We greatly appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Please connect with us and share this show with friends, family and coworkers on social media or However you share podcasts,
Speaker 1: you can send us questions, feedback and salutes by email to awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com
Speaker 2: by phone. You can leave us a message or text at 802858 kind That's 8028585463
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Speaker 2: Our show is edited by Chris Albertine, an assistant produced by Brigitte Dowd
Speaker 1: Thanks Kris and Brigitte.
Speaker 1: Oh
Speaker 1: oh,