Episode 326 - 2020 Tipping

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Speaker 1: Maybe it's just that you don't know how to use social courtesy. That's old fashion.

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Speaker 1: Watch how busy post and damn posts and act as host and hostess.

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Speaker 1: They know that courtesy means showing respect, thinking of

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Speaker 2: the other person. Really Friendliness.

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Speaker 2: Hello and welcome toe awesome etiquette,

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Speaker 1: where we explore modern etiquette through the lens of consideration, respect and honesty.

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Speaker 2: On today's show, we take your questions on increasing tips for servers because of the pandemic, writing personalized notes and books, sending a proper thank you to someone working from home and signatures on text messages for

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Speaker 1: awesome etiquette sustaining members. Our question of the week is about greeting other household members in the morning and saying goodbye

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Speaker 2: when you leave later in the day, plus your most excellent feedback etiquette salute and a postscript where we discuss gifting. All that's coming up.

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Speaker 2: Awesome etiquette comes to you from the studios of our home offices in Vermont and is proud to be produced by the Emily Post Institute.

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Speaker 1: I'm Lizzy Post,

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Speaker 2: and I'm Dan Post sending

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Speaker 1: Well, it's been a week, but I figure we should actually do a quick recap on Thanksgiving since we haven't actually had her Thanksgiving when we recorded the last episode, How was your Thanksgiving? Because it was awesome. Nice, Nice. I like that answer.

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Speaker 2: So I was sitting on the couch with Pooja last night, and I turned to her and said, Can you believe that Thanksgiving was on Lee five days ago or something like that just felt like so long

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Speaker 1: ago Way

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Speaker 2: Both did the math and our head knows just last the end of last week, not the week before that. But, no,

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Speaker 1: there's been a

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Speaker 2: shift, a change in gears, for

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Speaker 1: sure s well, we had a nice holiday, but we're really missing missing the rest of our family. But it was nice to eat a meal with my folks and and have it be kind of a traditional, really comforting meal. And it was also fun. I kind of held off on holiday movies and things like that until after Thanksgiving. I wanted to kind of celebrate my holidays in order. So I tried to find, like, Thanksgiving themed comfort movies, you know, But it was really fun to kind of dive into getting ready. We celebrate Christmas, and so it was. It was fun to dive into getting ready for some of Christmas and kind of let that holiday cheer of seeing the neighborhood put up lights and things like that. Start toe start to inspire and and comfort.

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Speaker 2: Did I tell you what a Nisha's thing that she is thankful for is

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Speaker 1: No. What was it Christmas on? She takes after her dad,

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Speaker 2: but we did the same thing. We It was the day after Thanksgiving that Friday, and we just started that process of taking out the boxes and going through the Christmas decorations. It was so much fun. She's just hitting that age where the characters in the creche set our toys. They're coming alive for her, the trimming the tree is something she can participate in. And it's just so much fun.

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Speaker 1: She's really experiencing it, though, you know, for for all its glory, it's nice. Exactly, Uh, but I gotta tell you, because before we leave

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Speaker 2: Thanksgiving completely Way also had a bit of a Thanksgiving etiquette catastrophe. Did

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Speaker 1: you really? We kind of did.

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Speaker 2: And it was you talking about the the feeling of satisfaction around that meal and sitting down for that meal, and we totally blew it. We never achieved

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Speaker 1: that way

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Speaker 2: had an awesome Thanksgiving in so many ways. But we actually never

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Speaker 1: achieved why we never table table. Well, that was a different excuse, but I had a hard time actually

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Speaker 2: getting the instagram toe work. I just I

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Speaker 1: realize he's admitting it. He's throwing himself under the bus. I actually

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Speaker 2: tried. I spent about 15 minutes. I was sitting there with my phone. I was

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Speaker 1: like, How do you call your cousin to say Lizzie, How do I do this? I was trying to do a story. I didn't know how to do a story. Oh, guys. So, guys, now you know why? Why our instagram? It doesn't have a lot of personal participation. Um, we'll get way will get you confident on the Instagram.

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Speaker 2: I appreciate that. So short story much longer. The reason the meal never came together was our coordination of all of our family Zoom calls wasn't done well, each each call had been set up well, but the timing over the course of the day and we were delivering Thanksgiving food to other people and just the way our day unrolled. And then we had kidnaps and kid lunches and the actual meal wasn't till like mid afternoon at that point, people that had these kind of partial lunches and

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Speaker 2: that part was a little disappointing. It was, like way overbooked. We overbooked. We didn't prioritize ourselves. So learned a lesson. Next year that will be

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Speaker 1: better. Next year, I'm sure, will be different. But that is

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Speaker 2: for next year. And for now I'm letting Thanksgiving go and thinking about the future. And I apologize about the Instagram. I will. I will get there,

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Speaker 1: But we'll get you that we'll get you there. You

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Speaker 2: are turning into it. Instagram savant.

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Speaker 1: No, that's not true. Maybe by comparison, since you can't figure out a story. But I would say that I had a ton of fun last night. I got to do an Instagram live with at Populate E Tracy, who gives tips and reviews on everyday living. And it was so much fun because she's a long time like five year podcast listener. She knew episodes and questions and was able to ask about them and reference what we talked about. And I just had so much fun. It was it was the best thing talking Teoh, a awesome etiquette listener for that long because it felt so much like what I think we sometimes wish we could do to this show, which is open up the conversation, um, or have mawr conversations with people other than just us. And don't get me wrong. Dan and I talk so much because we really do like talking to each other. And so we love doing the show as to host bouncing things off. But hearing the direct problems someone else was dealing with how they felt about it when it got awkward, what actually ended, Like getting to talk to someone all the way through the issue or the question at hand and examined the personalities, like with the person, right? There was unbelievable, so much fun. It was

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Speaker 2: that part that sounded so interesting to me, this idea of Well, okay, so in this particular situation, would this kind

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Speaker 1: of approach work

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Speaker 2: with this kind of person? You know them and be able to get that answer and really refined an answer. I bet it was really satisfying.

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Speaker 1: It was really, really fun. And it was also just fun getting to kind of be face to face with listeners, you know, we've done emailing. We do a lot of back and forth of the via text or or on the social media and Dems and things like that. But it was really cool to be live with someone and kind of get to geek out together on etiquette. You know, we talked about gifting etiquette, re gifting etiquette. Lizzie Post. Did you end

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Speaker 2: up talking about etiquette?

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Speaker 1: We did. We talked about so much etiquette. Surprise, surprise. But it was so much fun because it was like in the we weren't I guess, e mean you are always trying to give advice, but it was fun to talk about what I probably would actually do with the actual characters in my life. You know what I mean? It was like I don't know, like I'm cheeky. I would say this like and hope I could get away with it with a nice apology in my back pocket if I if I didn't, you know, it was really fun conversation, But I also got to do another interview with a podcast listener, Tracy Fox, who is host of the Happy Self podcast. She's also an author, and she was awesome. She's another kind of person in the world of etiquette and just the conversation that we had. I really, really loved it. I hope you guys will give a listen. We're going thio be posting links to it in the coming week. And it was just a lot of, um it was like it was again kind of getting to geek out with another version of Dan. You know what I mean? Like it was It was really cool. So could that

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Speaker 2: be the Instagram version of

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Speaker 1: me? You want Tracy to be the instagram version of? You

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Speaker 2: know, I need to be the instagram version, but

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Speaker 1: we're gonna get you were going to get you up there and doing that. Don't you worry. And yes, both of these women were named Tracy. I had to Tracy interviews. Well,

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Speaker 2: thank you to both of the Tracy's for being long time listeners and for drawing us out into that instagram world just a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Do you think, cousin, that it might be time for us to get to some questions?

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Speaker 2: Let's do it. Awesome. Etiquette is here to answer your questions. You can email them awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com you can leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind. That's 8028585463 You can also reach us on social media on Twitter. We're at Emily Post. Insist on Instagram were at Emily Post Institute and on Facebook were awesome etiquette. Just remember, use the hashtag awesome etiquette with your post so that we know you want your question on the show.

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Speaker 1: Our first question is asking, Are we changing tips due to co vid Hi Dan and Lizzie? I wanted to write because I know one couple who is obsessed with money. They like to go all out for outdoor dining, and it's a nice time until the bill comes around. Now I normally like to tip 20% and don't necessarily lower it for worse service. Because wait staff deserve a living wage. I do a little less for take out

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Speaker 1: now that food service workers are risking their health to help people have somewhat normal dining experiences. I like to do 20% for take out in 25% for restaurant service. While I don't expect everyone to stick to my exact numbers and percentages. This person likes to tip 17% which I just think is too low to give someone who risked their health to give us good experience and in my mind doesn't show enough appreciation. Other people in our friend group feel the same way about this. Would the acceptable response be for each party to tip as they see fit? I can also see that his wife is embarrassed when he does this, as she is personally generous with retail workers. So would it also be okay for me to bring it up to the wife, who is my closer friend in private? Sincerely embarrassed dinner guest. There's a tough there's a tough spot to be in. It is,

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Speaker 2: and I want to thank embarrassed dinner guest for the question. This is, Ah,

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Speaker 2: new approach to a covert etiquette. Then we've definitely heard about tipping around social distancing, and there have been a few things that have changed mostly around the numbers of the different kinds of people that people are thinking about tipping. We're getting service in different ways, so that,

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Speaker 2: um, generally I've noticed, is expanding the way people are thinking about tipping, and this is the first. I've heard the idea that the embarrassed dinner guest presented of starting to feel an expectation that table service, which is a really established etiquette, tradition and expectation we refer to it here is part of the social contract. When you're eating out that that tip that you do first, um,

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Speaker 2: table service or meals that are prepared and brought to you at a table. The idea that that would be pushed up a little bit is intuitively makes sense. But I also want to be really clear that that's not something that any etiquette credentialing agency has signed off on. And to the extent that the Emily Post Institute monitors these types of ships in trends, this is not a trend. That and I'm going to step out on a limb here, Lizzie, you could say whether you support me and this or not, that I would think of as a universal change right now, I understand all of the thinking behind it that you want to show Mawr appreciation that Mawr is going into providing the service than before and at the same time, because thes traditions air so established collectively over time that there really needs to be both a large collective adoption and a little bit of time before that kind of a tradition is going to change in a way that I think it's an expectation you could have of other people.

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Speaker 1: Hmm. I'm for me. When I'm hearing this question, you'll notice I'm about to sidestep judging down in any way. No, I'm just kidding. I'm in the same spot as you because but I'm gonna modify it a little bit. I have seen people choose to increase the amount that they're giving right now. I think a lot of people a want to support the restaurant industry, which is seriously struggling. And so if they have the means to bump their tip up whatever percentage they feel, I mean, I know some people are able to be very generous and give double whatever they're paying, you know? I mean, like, some people are really going for it. Ah, lot of people can't do that, though. And so the place that the world of etiquette has landed during the pandemic is that you are more than welcome always to tip as much as you want. There is no limit. Sky is the limit on tipping, but typically in these particular circumstances, whether it's take out or whether it's dining in or, um, these air what we still traditionally see as the sort of minimums. And that's still that 15 to 20% range, or for take out its ah couple of extra dollars on the bill, or oftentimes, that take out the percentage people go up to his 10%. But you could also go higher if you're really grateful and you really want to help try and help others out during the pandemic and you can. There's no reason not to, but that the minimums air still there and 17% is still within that. It's higher than the 15, which we say is the lowest for dying in service. But the issue that I'm really seeing here is one that has been common pandemic or not, and that is, I'm embarrassed by the tip my host has left, and that, I think, is an interesting conundrum, and the way I would solve it is either asked to split the bill, and you leave the tip that you feel appropriate on your bill or asked to take care of the bill, if you can, and you leave the tip that you feel is appropriate when someone else is taking care of everything for you, you tend to not make it your business. What they have decided to put down. I get that. You unfortunately, no, that this person does this. You've noticed it. You become aware of it. So now you're feeling like you can't ignore it. And this is where and Dan, I'm looking for your help on it. What do you think about the idea of going back later and just leaving a little something extra? Whether you remember the name of your server, whether you, you know, stop back. You know, once everyone's gone their separate ways, Um, there's a great scene in friends, the TV show Friends, where Ross tries to do this and Rachel's dad Phillips out on him. Um, what do you What do you think about that idea?

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Speaker 2: I like it. I'm calling it

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Speaker 1: a 20

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Speaker 2: 20 exemption, and I've been trying to think of a way to do it myself. And I was imagining approaching the restaurant and you could just say this is something I like to do. We ate here and I so appreciate your being here, whatever it is. And I like to leave a little gratuity for the service staff just just from me. And I think that is, uh that is, you say in the spirit of stepping it up. Just what you want to do in this particular moment, Thio show that gratitude the root of gratuity to be appreciative and to do it in explicit way. I think that's okay. And I wouldn't make a big deal of it in front of the other person. In fact,

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Speaker 1: yeah, that was my next question. Would explicitly

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Speaker 2: not. I think this is one of those moments where you want that good deed to be something that is coming from you. That isn't a comment on probably anyone else has done. Andi, That's the way I think you generate that that room around. What is your right? A classic and thorny etiquette issue of that. You really shouldn't even be interested in the first place. What? Your host is tipping.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, our listener does ask, you know, should I talk to my his wife, my friend in private that you know about this and I tend to say I like the other suggestion. Better of just taking care of it in your own way again, either by being the person who pays the bill suggesting that you guys go, you know, split that, split the tabs and pay your own way or by doing his dance suggests, and kind of either having something ready as you were on your way out of the restaurant. But doing it privately, not in front of the person or going back later and and letting the restaurant know who the tip is for or just for the pool in general.

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Speaker 2: Embarrassed Dinner Guest. We understand that this can feel like an awkward situation, and we hope that our answer provides a little clarity and a few more peaceful dinners in the future.

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Speaker 1: Restaurant here is a business employing over two million persons and doing over $2 billion worth of business annually, all because people have to eat, like to eat and don't like the work of fixing their own food.

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Speaker 1: Our next question is titled Personalized Pages. Dear

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Speaker 2: Lizzie and Dan. I hope this message finds you well. I have a question regarding writing dedications inside books when I give somebody a book, especially a dear friend. I like to write a few personal words on one of the first pages, but recently I heard that on Lien actual author can make a dedication inside a book. Otherwise, you should Onley attach a card. Is this the correct etiquette rule? I often receive books with dedications from my friends, not authors, and many times I bought secondhand books with somebody's personal note written inside. Please let me know your thoughts as books are the perfect gift, and I'm planning to send some this Christmas to my loved ones who I won't be able to visit. Thank you and Happy Holidays. Best Wishes D

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Speaker 1: Oh, no. I think we're gonna have to give out etiquette to merit cards to all those people who wrote all those inscriptions and all those books. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, break out the rulers. No, it's definitely totally fine to write an inscription in a book. At least I have never been told as an author otherwise or heard of it being rude to the author in any kind of way. I've received many a book, especially in childhood, that had a happy 12th birthday written for me. Usually they wouldn't write it on the first page, but it would be on the actual, Like, I'm thinking of the Children's books. I would get Dan where they're like hardcover, you know, big books. And on that, like, inside hard cover, which usually has some beautiful illustration. There is a pretty color or something like that. There would be a, you know, happy 12th birthday or happy. Okay. Maybe like eighth birthday from your godmother, you know, or something like that. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, something like that. I'm thinking of all the places you go with that kind of a message. You know, I've always thought that that was really lovely and in in antique books that we get and in Emily post books that people send to us. I love it when there is some kind of inscription or writing from a previous owner in it.

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Speaker 2: Can I offer the e?

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Speaker 1: Wouldn't call

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Speaker 2: it a counter thought, but sort of another frame to think about this in and I agree with you 1000%. I like that personalization. I love that feeling of connection. The one thing I have heard at signing events or a question that people have asked is whether or not when, as an author signing a book, you sign it just with your name or to somebody or for someone in particular. And if you sign it to someone, or for someone in particular, it actually decreases the value of the signed Copy that for people that are book collectors, the ultimate thing toe have is a mint condition book with an author signature in it. No,

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Speaker 1: and that's also one thing Peter Post taught me was that it's on Lee the signature that the best wishes or the, you know Stay Kind actually diminishes the value of the signature being on

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Speaker 2: it as well. Exactly. And the even the more personalized the note, the more specific it is and the less value it has so that

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Speaker 1: there's that to consider. It

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Speaker 2: might not strip away the value to the person Receiving it at all, in fact, might increase it for them. Make it that treasure personal memory. On the flip side, if you were really thinking dollars and cents investments in things which I don't think many people are when they're thinking about,

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Speaker 1: maybe you're sending antique books

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Speaker 2: that would be just the other. The other thought that popped in my mind as I was reading this question.

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Speaker 1: No, it's a It's a good one toe have de We certainly don't think that you would be categorized as rude for putting any inscriptions in, but we hope that this conversation helps you make a decision for your wonderful gifts this holiday season

00:21:25

Speaker 1: on Look, they all have their books with them. All the Children are quiet while they read, aren't they? Mhm.

00:21:37

Speaker 1: This question is titled out of the office. Thank you. Notes Dear Lizzie and Dan. First, I want to thank you for your podcast. I discovered it a few years ago when I was in college. You help me navigate interactions and relationships with consideration, respect and honesty. The notion of treat others as they would like to be treated really shifted my perspective. And I can't thank you enough for the work that you dio my question. I recently applied for graduate school Congratulations. I had to acquire letters of recommendation from three faculty members from my former academic institution. As part of my application, I'd like to send formal handwritten thank you notes to my letter writers. The problem is, I'm worried that if I send the letters to their office on campus, they won't receive them as many faculty members air working from home due to co vid. What do you suggest? I dio Should I send a thank you email? I prefer not thio. Should I send a thank you card and hope it gets to them? Do I send a hybrid thank you email and thank you card? Even pre cove it. I had a fear that the recipients of handwritten thank you notes wouldn't receive them. Thank you so very much for your time and consideration of my question. I look forward to the prospect of hearing my question and answer. Sorry if hearing my question and your answer on the show best Molly Molly is a great question.

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Speaker 2: Molly, thank you for writing in and thank you for reflecting back to us the idea that it's important toe think about treating other people the way they would like to be treated and letting us know that that idea had some significance for you. I think it's really important, and it's a big part of what we do here it. Emily Post.

00:23:12

Speaker 2: As far as your particular etiquette question here, I think we have a pretty particular etiquette answer that we can

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Speaker 1: provide on. I would say Go for it, Go for it.

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Speaker 2: There is no cost here. Go with your hybrid plan, I'd say Touch on both ways. Send that email and follow up with a handwritten thank you note that you get in the mail. I completely understand the anxiety about getting there or not. The snail mail, as it's often times referred to these days, although it's not that slow. I love to tell people it's gonna get there in a couple of days, is remarkably reliable and dependable, and it can feel a little strange. It could be a little different if you're not used to using it. And that's one of things that so miraculously about it. You have a physical thing that you hand off to somebody, and they take that physical thing all the way to the other person and get it to them. And people are pretty good about forwarding mail about moving stuff onto. People are picking stuff up. It might take a little longer to get there, but it most likely will so have confidence in that. But send that email also so that you feel good. In the meantime,

00:24:16

Speaker 1: I think so. And I think that in the email I would mention the note because the notes that that higher thing that you really want, you know, and that that you really want a want them to receive want them to know about, um, S o I might write something in the email that said, You know, I wanted to thank you so much for writing a letter for me. I have sent a a snail mail note or a male note to your office, but wasn't sure how male was getting to you, so I wanted to send an email

00:24:41

Speaker 2: us. Well, thank you so much for the record.

00:24:43

Speaker 1: Thank you so much. You can I and I was gonna say you could either just simply do it. Thank you so much again for writing the letter. I really appreciate it or you can actually, like, say this. This is what's coming in the mail and have the actual thank you that you've written in your letter as well. It's up to you.

00:25:00

Speaker 2: The final thing I'd mention is, don't worry if you don't hear that it's been received that one of the things about a thank you notice that you don't write a thank you note for thank you know, and there's not an obligation to call and tell someone that it got there that, um, if you don't hear from the person, it doesn't mean that they didn't receive it.

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Speaker 1: And here we have one of those frustrating parts of etiquette where

00:25:23

Speaker 1: you it's almost like you. You want to know that that thank you has been heard and it's so hard not knowing. And I do think a lot of times, that's why people end up leaning on, whether it's I mean, email. Still, you're not guaranteed to reply. Text message. You're not guaranteed to reply, but phone call like a phone call. Thank you where you could really express yourself and then here in the moment that the other person or that in person, thank you where in real time, you know, they've heard it end up being like just such desirable thank you mechanisms, you know what I mean? It's like it's very satisfying to know that you're thank you actually got there. And I'm not saying we should create a rule that says You have to let someone know that they're thank you arrived But it's not a bad thing. Ah, Quick, little and you don't have Thio But just a quick little Hey, you know, thank you so much for your lovely thank you note. It was lovely or got your thank you

00:26:16

Speaker 2: know, I was happy to help to go down that

00:26:18

Speaker 1: route E Oh,

00:26:20

Speaker 2: thank you for thank you notes.

00:26:22

Speaker 1: It's not to thank them for them, but to acknowledge that it was received. Received your thank you note was happy to help, you know? Like there you go. That's not thanking someone for a thank you note. It's just acknowledging the gratitude that game your way and again, it's not a rule. We're not making up a rule. No extra rules. Right now,

00:26:41

Speaker 1: Molly, it sounds like

00:26:42

Speaker 2: you're approaching this application process with a lot of intentionality. We wish you the best of luck as you keep going. And good luck getting those. Thank you. Notes out the door.

00:26:50

Speaker 1: Yes. You see good manners. Wherever there are people who respect each other and want to get along with others. Sometimes, though, you find a person like Niki Taylor who has lost sight of the importance of good manners or who hasn't realized the values of consideration for others.

00:27:07

Speaker 1: Our

00:27:07

Speaker 2: next question is about texts and tone.

00:27:11

Speaker 2: Hello. I have a question about texting etiquette. My boss signs his name or initials when he texts or chats. It doesn't matter whether we're chatting via mobile or Microsoft teams. He frequently includes his name at the end of text bubbles. It's

00:27:25

Speaker 1: usually what

00:27:26

Speaker 2: he's written a few sentences to reply to a question. It's not a big deal, but I feel his habit reflects a misunderstanding of the slight differences between email and text chat communication and just appears a little weird. Have you texting as a bit less formal and plus text bubbles usually have initials or profile pics next to them. It's already clear who sent the message so a sign off isn't usually necessary After an initial greeting, Um, I

00:27:53

Speaker 2: am I correct to think it's unnecessary to include a name at the end of a text message, and if so, is this something I should bring to my boss's attention? I doubt this behavior is causing any harm. But it just doesn't sit well with me for some reason. And I feel he should know. Thanks, James

00:28:09

Speaker 1: James. I love that this is a great generational divide thing, right? Like E. Yeah, it's not hip, Um, but but and I think I think that you are you are right in that it often appear Soto other people who are seeing assigned name under an already identified user or conversation participant, right? So, like in a slack or in a team's your name and who you are is identified in the message that you're posting. So it is redundant to put, you know, Doug at the bottom or something like that. And but the thing that I will say is, I'm not sure that it actually reflects a misunderstanding of the service or the platform or the mechanism that you're using to communicate. I think it's a leftover habit from, like first experiences with digital communications often being emails, and you're just used to signing your name on those things. And rather than realize you could drop that in text message or team message conversations, it's like carried over and and that's where, like it does show the kind of disconnect and that you haven't kind of totally gotten on board with these with these conversation tools. I don't know, Dan. Am I Am I wrong? Am I right? What do you think? No,

00:29:31

Speaker 2: I think you're

00:29:32

Speaker 1: right. No, I think you're right. This is

00:29:37

Speaker 2: one of those where I I like the framing at the end. I doubt this behavior is causing any harm because to me, it falls very much into that no harm, no foul territory where it really isn't asking any extra of someone toe. See that name at the bottom of text? It's almost the most work for the person who has to type it each time or dictated, but that spirit of it not causing any harm. So to me, that really de escalates whether or not you should take any action that it's not a broccoli on the tooth rule situation for me like you, I sort of see it as a holdover, maybe even from written communication. When you used to shot a note out to someone, you put your name at the bottom of it Before you stuck the posted on the top of the file that went to the next office or whatever it waas.

00:30:25

Speaker 2: I also really appreciated the spirit of this email and the last last sentence. I feel we should know. It just doesn't sit quite right with me. And I don't want to say, Don't say anything because if you had a good relationship with the boss that you could talk to you about

00:30:42

Speaker 1: this kind of stuff

00:30:43

Speaker 2: things that create impressions but aren't affecting our dramatically affecting your whole opinion or perspective about someone. This isn't a mission critical issue, but it's just a heads up that you're calling

00:30:57

Speaker 1: it cool instead, base exactly

00:30:59

Speaker 2: or whatever. Whatever the thing is, they might appreciate it if there was a way you could deliver that in a really low stakes way as part of a conversation about how we all communicate our maybe it's a discussion about people's little idiosyncracies, and that happens to be the one you could throw out about the boss.

00:31:21

Speaker 1: Be careful, though, James. You never know. You might end up now being your bosses person for for, you know, proper

00:31:29

Speaker 2: toning up your digital

00:31:30

Speaker 1: millennial interaction. I don't know. Digital interaction. Yeah, you never know, but yeah, I think I'm I'm with you, Dan. No harm, no foul. And at the same time, if you had the right relationship with this person, you could probably find a way to say it. I do think with the delivery, and again we've already established has to be someone you can have this kind of report with. But the delivery

00:31:54

Speaker 1: has toe leave out any tone of like, you were embarrassing yourself. Or like Boy, it really makes you show your age or something like that. You want to leave those kinds of

00:32:06

Speaker 1: ideas, tones, feelings out of it when you're delivering it. And I'm going to admit, I don't know exactly what that would sound like right now. We might come up with it later. Um, but it z definitely something that you're gonna want to tread really carefully with. And I think it's got to be a really good match of person and, like, receiver and delivery for it to be worth it, you know, especially because it's not a big deal exactly. James, Thank you so much. This is a really interesting question, and we would love it if you would report back with what you end up deciding to dio

00:32:43

Speaker 1: good manners, make good first impressions and because your manners air showing all the time they have a lot to do with how well people like you.

00:32:56

Speaker 1: Yeah,

00:32:59

Speaker 1: thank you so much for your questions. Please send us updates or feedback on our answers. Toe awesome etiquette at Emily post dot com or leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind. That's 8028585463 You can also find us on social media on Twitter. We're at Emily Post Inst That's I N S t on instagram were at Emily Post Institute and on Facebook were awesome etiquette. Just remember to use the hashtag awesome etiquette with your Social Media post so that we know you want your question on the show. And please definitely send questions in. There's no show without you.

00:33:40

Speaker 1: Just

00:33:45

Speaker 1: if you

00:33:46

Speaker 2: love awesome etiquette, please consider becoming a sustaining member. You can find out more about this by visiting us at patryan dot com slash awesome etiquette. You'll get in ads, free version of the show and access to bonus questions and content. Plus, you'll feel great knowing that you helped to keep awesome etiquette on the air and to you and to those of you who are already sustaining members. Thank you for your support. It's time for our feedback segment where we hear from you about the questions we answer and the topics we cover. And today we hear from Sydney about zoom on Thanksgiving.

00:34:17

Speaker 1: Oh, I'm gonna like this. Say that high. Lizzie and Dan, this is Sydney. I had a solution to the Thanksgiving zoom question. What we did is after our meal, those of us who were in, you know, the house together. We set up a zoom in advance and said The zoom will be open from three PM to six PM and anybody who wants to or who can just pop in at any old time and say hello and it was great. We had people popping in at all hours. We had time to spend with everybody. Some people didn't know each other, but they got to know each other. And some people, you know, we're just eating their meals. Some people had just finished their meal, some people were between courses

00:35:04

Speaker 1: and there was no problem. So we found that to be a very easy solution. E was right. I did like it. I love that idea of kind of like an open house for your zoom call. Absolutely. I think those are some

00:35:16

Speaker 2: of my favorite calls. Also, there is so little pressure as long as everybody understands that, it's just this is just another room in the house, essentially. And

00:35:26

Speaker 2: as long as people also understand that there is a live mic and camera, those very casual gatherings are some of my absolute favorites.

00:35:35

Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sending in the feedback, Sydney, and thank you for sending us your thoughts and updates. Please keep them coming. You can send your feedback or update toe awesome medicated Emily post dot com Or leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind. That's 8028585463

00:35:57

Speaker 1: It's time for a postscript segment where we dive deeper into a topic of etiquette and tis the season for us to talk about gifting. I feel like it's unusual thing.

00:36:08

Speaker 2: Okay, before we start before we start, can I say one thing?

00:36:13

Speaker 2: Yeah, One big thing. Yeah, So the oldest cliche about gift giving remains the oldest cliche because we say it all the time because it is true. Okay, really, is the thought that counts.

00:36:27

Speaker 1: You're going to start us off with sentiment. That's really good. It is the thought that counts. That hasn't changed, and

00:36:33

Speaker 2: it's what feels good about it. It's the thing that you just really wanna. I think zero in on and we're gonna talk about a lot of sort of tips. Common mistakes. People make things for good gift giving. But I think the big picture thought that I always like to start any

00:36:49

Speaker 2: well, postscript about gifting that we're going to do

00:36:51

Speaker 1: with the annual post script that we dio

00:36:54

Speaker 2: think about the person. Think about the relation. Think about the care that you have for them and for your relationship to them and try to give something that honors that that'll make them feel good, and you're probably going to be in pretty good shape.

00:37:06

Speaker 1: Don't get us wrong. It can be hard. It can be hard if you're not particularly good at coming up with gift ideas, but we we do always suggest that that you know this person and let what you know, guide you and and it's like, you know said, Be confident, right? Like, be confident you could do this well, but that being said, one of the other places we like to start, which I think is some of our most reassuring advice Is that you? Absolutely, When gifting. Sorry is that when gifting, it is absolutely appropriate to stick within your budget and budgets change year to year. So each year you're probably going to evaluate what you have to work with, and then the list of people that you have to give

00:37:49

Speaker 2: Thio It will make it so much easier to stick to that budget if you do a little bit of advanced planning. If you take the time ahead of time to think about

00:37:59

Speaker 2: who's on your list and how you want to prioritize that. And if there are specific things or particular things that you were really hoping toe do or to get for people that you can start toe, get a sense for what that budget looks like by thinking systematically ahead of time

00:38:13

Speaker 1: in sticking with your budget that also includes that you don't have to get gifts that are of equal value to people who give to you. And I think that that's that's one thing that can and you might actually be in a situation where that's the requirement. Like if you're in a group gift exchange at work and they say Keep it under $10. Obviously, that's a place where you're gonna you're gonna have very similar priced items. But if you receive gifts that were really generous, you A We all know that you don't have toe reciprocate. Gift giving isn't reciprocal that if you hadn't had someone on your list and they give you a gift, you really want to focus on that gift and the giving that they have done as opposed to you not having something for them but within the gifts that you do do exchanges for where it is. I give to you and you give to me. You should still feel confident sticking within that budget of yours. Andi. I think that that's that's something that we reiterate every single year, and it never loses its importance. It is. And if you

00:39:15

Speaker 2: thought about the person and you've done your best toe, think of something that they would really like her. Appreciate That's the thing that they're going to remember mawr than how much you spent on them. Exactly. You know, one way that people sometimes save a little bit on gifting is that they're tempted to

00:39:33

Speaker 1: re gift. They are tempted to re gift. And boy, was this ever a heated debate among the fourth generation of the post family is re gifting. Okay,

00:39:43

Speaker 2: so in the spirit of approaching re gifting well as something that could potentially offer a fence where people have let us know that they've been hurt, we

00:39:55

Speaker 2: strongly advised following these guidelines. If you're considering re gifting, the first point that

00:40:01

Speaker 2: I think is the sweet point is that you re give something that you think someone would like, that you're really operating from that place of giving a gift that comes from a place of consideration, that it's something that you genuinely think they would appreciate. That's that's where a gift should come from. If you're not harboring this thought, Oh, I'm clearing out my closet. Then you can feel really good about the thing it is that you're giving so a type of gift that would fall outside of the possibility for consideration is anything that is personalized or crafted or made specifically for you. So a trade that's been engraved or a monogrammed anything or something that someone needed

00:40:47

Speaker 1: those items air ones that absolutely cannot be re gifted. And they are ones that if they are re gifted, it's often noticed quickly, and it falls super flat because of the personalization, especially when it comes to those monograms or dates like engravings and things like that. They often are really the big dead giveaway, and it's it's not a good idea to gift those because they're also then monogrammed are agreed with things that are useless to the people who have them. You know what I mean? Slightly

00:41:18

Speaker 2: trickier Territory are gifts that are in original packaging, and they're particularly tempting that original packaging actually puts it on the candidate for re gifting list.

00:41:30

Speaker 1: Things like kill your framing that Dan would e. I would have just said It's gotta be in its original packaging, but you're like if it's in the original packaging, that makes it a candidate for a potential re gift. I

00:41:43

Speaker 2: know I'm tiptoeing up to this one and e. I also think it's important and this is actually, for me, sort of the most likely candidates for re gifting. The reality is we live in a world of mass produced

00:41:57

Speaker 2: consumable and disposable goods. And, um, there really is very little practical reason to have two of the same blenders or two of the same instead pots or whatever it is. Although we do use dueling into pots occasionally, Um,

00:42:13

Speaker 2: but it za reality of the world that we live in. It za practical reality that I think has shifted the ground that people stand on when they think about re gifting. So if it's in great condition, if it's still in that original packaging, e think a lot of people are going to understand

00:42:30

Speaker 2: so original packaging or really, really, really great condition

00:42:35

Speaker 1: like that amendment really, really, really great condition.

00:42:40

Speaker 1: So those air sort of the qualifiers for if you are going to choose to re grift and not really make any announcements to anybody that this re gifting is happening. Thea other way that you could re gift is toe honestly and openly re gift something and to say, Dan, I got to insta pots. I know that you have to already, But I really thought you'd want a third, you know, because you use them so frequently. And I've heard you mentioned you might actually be going for a third. I really wanted to gift you my extra insta pot, because I know you'd love it. That's an open and honest re gifting when someone sends you two copies of our etiquette books this year because they know you're a netiquette

00:43:20

Speaker 2: G just like,

00:43:21

Speaker 1: yes, you can re gift one to someone else properly and openly. But there there is that option in the world of re gift as well. You you know, it doesn't have to be an act of sneakiness. In fact, if that's the reason behind it, it's probably not the way you want to be doing it.

00:43:42

Speaker 2: So because I have one mawr gifting tip that's particular to 2020.

00:43:48

Speaker 1: Okay, what's that?

00:43:49

Speaker 2: And my tip is could have fallen toe that category of tip that I find myself giving quite frequently recently, which is get ready. Prepare. Do it early. This is one of those years where I know I personally am not gonna be able to do a lot of my usual last minute holiday rounds like

00:44:09

Speaker 1: the run around those couple of days? Exactly.

00:44:12

Speaker 2: So if these things matter to you, if holiday season full of gifting and gift exchanges is important, um, take this post script as your opportunity toe not just set a budget, but also think about your calendar on, uh, a little bit of advanced preparation, I think has the potential to set us all up for a really joyful holiday season this year.

00:44:33

Speaker 1: And I have a feeling that this particular holiday season will be a little extended. We've been warned that the mail services and the delivery services are all going to be quite saturated, and so it wouldn't surprise me if it if we're gifting right on into early January this year.

00:44:50

Speaker 2: Worse things could happen,

00:44:51

Speaker 1: however you end up gifting. We hope that you are excited about the holiday season and excited to participate, and that maybe, just maybe, some beautiful surprises come your way,

00:45:04

Speaker 1: way like to end our show on a high note. So we turn to you to hear about the good etiquette you're seeing and experiencing out in the world, and that can come in so many forms and today we hear from Lynne.

00:45:16

Speaker 2: Hello, Lizzie and Dan. Imagine my delight as I tuned into the sustaining member question this week and heard the question I sent you. Thank you for answering it and sending helpful support for whatever decision I make, as

00:45:28

Speaker 1: well as some

00:45:29

Speaker 2: good ideas to use to. Thanks again for all your great advice, Lynn.

00:45:34

Speaker 1: Let's see. We got a salute. We did. We got a salute. Lynn, thank you so much. We're so glad that the answer helped and that it delighted you to hear it on the show that that's what we love Thio here. And we're just tickled.

00:45:47

Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Lynn.

00:45:51

Speaker 2: Thank you for listening.

00:45:54

Speaker 1: Thank you to everyone who sent

00:45:56

Speaker 2: us something. Thank you to everyone who supports us on Patriots.

00:45:59

Speaker 1: Please connect with us and share this show with friends, family and co workers. And, of course,

00:46:05

Speaker 2: on social media, you can send us your next question feedback or salute by email. Toe Awesome etiquette of Emily Post com. You can leave us a voicemail or text at 802858 kind. That's 8028585463 on Twitter. We're at Emily Post Inst on Instagram were at Emily Post Institute and on Facebook were Awesome Etiquette and The Emily Post Institute.

00:46:28

Speaker 1: Please consider becoming a sustaining member by visiting. Patryan!

00:46:32

Speaker 2: Com slash awesome etiquette. You can also subscribe to the ads version of our show on Spotify or your favorite podcast app, and please consider leaving us a review. It helps with our show ranking, which helps new listeners find awesome etiquette.

00:46:46

Speaker 2: Our show is

00:46:46

Speaker 1: edited by Chris Albertine and assistant produced by Brigitte Dowd. Thanks Kris and Brigitte.